AZO

AZO

Trenchbeast

Member
Messages
35
Anyone know the current situation with Kalamazoo? Ive read the Section 804 recommendation for merging the other Michigan approach controls and I'm confused exactly what the setup is out here and what the future will be like for this facility.
 

Move78

Forum Sage
Messages
822
Anyone know the current situation with Kalamazoo? Ive read the Section 804 recommendation for merging the other Michigan approach controls and I'm confused exactly what the setup is out here and what the future will be like for this facility.
It's going to be an 8 up/down with tons of slow radar sectors
 

corn4ahead

Forum Sage
Messages
411
It's going to be an 8 up/down with tons of slow radar sectors
This.

AZO tower is very slow generally. LAN doesn't have a whole lot going on. AZO App has Western Michigan U flight school which can get busy occasionally with practice approaches to AZO/BTL and what not. GRR will have the bulk of the commercial traffic for the new facility. MKG/FNT/MBS all are some of the slower tracons in the country. MKG I can get occasionally busy during OSHKOSH week I hear.
 

GMX

Trusted Contributor
Messages
146
Since AZO is a 6 right now, it will start as a 6 when they first start moving facilities over. They want to move MKG and GRR in Jan/Feb 2019 with LAN/MBS/FNT a couple months after. The cutover date for the latter was March 19 but the engineers have pushed it back to like May 12 already. If it gets delayed more, they will have to make it in the Fall because they cannot accomplish it in the summer.

The eventual facility level is not part of the MOU in any way, is non-negotiable, and NATCA neither agreed nor disagreed; the level is only set by traffic count validation. SO, NATCA did get the FAA to consider a new updated look at the traffic count with NATCAs CountOps people...not to "force" a level but to have accurate data to make the most informed decision for facility level. They said the FAA won't commit to a hard number because right now it's estimated. There is no TCI number but they said it "should" fall into lvl 8 easily.

When it becomes Great Lakes TRACON it will be a "new" facility and a full year of traffic data will not exist, so they will use 3 months per Appendix A of the contract: In circumstances where a facility meets all criteria for upgrade, EXCEPT that a full year of data does not exist, a validation may still take place. If it is determined that the missing data would have a de minimis impact on the calculation of the TCI, the validation will be conducted as though a full year of data exists.
 
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GMX

Trusted Contributor
Messages
146
If anyone's interested the total TRACON operations from 2017 are as follows:

GRR: 101,077
LAN: 87,364
AZO: 76,113
FNT: 52,053
MBS: 45,300
MKG: 43,926
 

Trenchbeast

Member
Messages
35
Since AZO is a 6 right now, it will start as a 6 when they first start moving facilities over. They want to move MKG and GRR in Jan/Feb 2019 with LAN/MBS/FNT a couple months after. The cutover date for the latter was March 19 but the engineers have pushed it back to like May 12 already. If it gets delayed more, they will have to make it in the Fall because they cannot accomplish it in the summer.

The eventual facility level is not part of the MOU in any way, is non-negotiable, and NATCA neither agreed nor disagreed; the level is only set by traffic count validation. SO, NATCA did get the FAA to consider a new updated look at the traffic count with NATCAs CountOps people...not to "force" a level but to have accurate data to make the most informed decision for facility level. They said the FAA won't commit to a hard number because right now it's estimated. There is no TCI number but they said it "should" fall into lvl 8 easily.

When it becomes Great Lakes TRACON it will be a "new" facility and a full year of traffic data will not exist, so they will use 3 months per Appendix A of the contract: In circumstances where a facility meets all criteria for upgrade, EXCEPT that a full year of data does not exist, a validation may still take place. If it is determined that the missing data would have a de minimis impact on the calculation of the TCI, the validation will be conducted as though a full year of data exists.
Once the merger happens fully will it still be an updown facility correct?

I'm asking because we heard that our tower academy list might have a significant amount of AZO slots.
 
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GMX

Trusted Contributor
Messages
146
It will be an up/down but not everyone will work all positions. The plan is for a west wall and an east wall (of scopes).

West works radar for AZO, GRR, MKG, and AZO Tower.

East works radar for FNT, also GRR, LAN, and MBS. Also LAN is 24 hours so that side works a mid and the other side doesn't.

That could be problematic for leave and other things I imagine.

In short, it'll technically be an up/down but only for some...
 

FightingIrish2012

Trusted Contributor
Messages
273
Splitting that up/down into two areas was a bit of a scam, it’s not like Philly or Miami tower. I get it’s a lot of airspace but all of those TRACONs were very low volume other then GRR. And the tower is not too busy either.
 

PushingTin

Forum Sage
Messages
367
Splitting that up/down into two areas was a bit of a scam, it’s not like Philly or Miami tower. I get it’s a lot of airspace but all of those TRACONs were very low volume other then GRR. And the tower is not too busy either.
ARB is a better facility, with an amazing facrep!
 

GMX

Trusted Contributor
Messages
146
Splitting that up/down into two areas was a bit of a scam, it’s not like Philly or Miami tower. I get it’s a lot of airspace but all of those TRACONs were very low volume other then GRR. And the tower is not too busy either.
GRR had 20.69% more radar operations than LAN (#2 behind GRR) in 2018. Their tower did way more than the other towers though.

AZO ended up not having a mid for the east wall.

With 6 radar airspaces and 1 tower, no one would be able to maintain currency on all 7 so that's why they each got 4 (GRR being the overlap on both walls). It's still kind of weird.
 

FoggyWindow

Member
FAA
Messages
56
Facility
ZHU Houston Center
Does anyone have an update on AZO in regards to 804 progress and/or level change?
Last I'd heard it was looking like it was gonna be an 8. Any idea if that's true? I'm from GRR originally so this would be a good way to get back near home.
 

GMX

Trusted Contributor
Messages
146
Still a 6. People getting antsy (understandably so) for the upgrade but it's "taking longer than planned". Some people ended up not qualifying for the PCS money too but had already sold houses and moved!
 
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