Everyone who is talking about level caps for transfer are absolutely ridiculous. So it should be up to the luck of draw on whether or not you get sent to a 10,11, or 12 Z fresh out of the academy but if you get terminal and go to a 4,5, or 6 you should be capped and take a decade minimum to get to a 12 when considering training and transfer times? If you get assigned a low level facility off the rip you should have the opportunity to go to a high level. Many do and many are making it through training successful. I do agree changes need to be made to help the mid level facilities but limiting our transfer power is idiotic.
Well if people from mid level facilities could get released it wouldn’t be an issue. Why should a busy TRACON only facility be selecting ERRs from level 4/5 tower only while candidates from mid level radar facilities are understaffed and ineligible for transfer?
You should just move up a level on the pay bands after you spend 7 years at a facility
I’m assuming this is an indictment on Article 100, which is only valid for facility in-grade or downgrade transfers (so if you’re at a 4 or 5 you’re basically fucked) and eligible after 8 years CPC time at present facility. A very stark difference to Article 124 for 15 years at 10-12s. An in-grade/downgrade could mean anywhere you want to go that has a chair for you to sit in.
Also I put in for about 14 different level 9 up downs and I'm still trapped because ncept releases to the 11s and 12s when you do get a release, not to the 9s
This is an underrated comment. Yes, since new hires can get country club mid levels now we as controllers should partially kick ourselves in the ass for so many of us filing paperwork to jump straight to 10-12s. BUT, it takes two to tango, anyone CAN file to go anywhere but it’s the agency that approves so many of these bottom-to-top ERRs and let understaffed 8s/9s sit on their middle finger.
Everyone who is talking about level caps for transfer are absolutely ridiculous. So it should be up to the luck of draw on whether or not you get sent to a 10,11, or 12 Z fresh out of the academy but if you get terminal and go to a 4,5, or 6 you should be capped and take a decade minimum to get to a 12 when considering training and transfer times? If you get assigned a low level facility off the rip you should have the opportunity to go to a high level. Many do and many are making it through training successful. I do agree changes need to be made to help the mid level facilities but limiting our transfer power is idiotic.
Ok so you're arguing against this. Here is the reality: if you get forced to a mid level or if the academy you'll be stuck for ten years trying to get to a high level.
You'd rather keep the system that fucks the mid level people.
I would rather build a pipeline to alleviate the problem with staffing mid level facilities that forces people to be stuck.
If 4,5, and 6 level controllers can only transfer to 7,8, and 9 respectively then those facilities will get staffing that has previously struggled. Those that have put in their time working actual traffic should be rewarded with the opportunity to leave.
Instead we have level 5 controllers that don't do any real work moving to Cookie cutter level 12 facilities that do high volume low complexity.
Instead we have level 5 controllers that don't do any real work moving to Cookie cutter level 12 facilities that do high volume low complexity.
The ones doing the work get fucked.
We had that for sure, now absolutely none of the low level up/downs can release thanks to this scheme called CRWG. And then the agency wants to send OTS hires to 8s & 9s because they’re somehow systemically disadvantaged to get staffing so a specially tailored academy pipeline was created just for them… make this fucking make sense.
We had that for sure, now absolutely none of the low level up/downs can release thanks to this scheme called CRWG. And then the agency wants to send OTS hires to 8s & 9s because they’re somehow systemically disadvantaged to get staffing so a specially tailored academy pipeline was created just for them… make this fucking make sense.
Id be curious to see the facility training data on this hiring track. The Academy pass rates have been insane compared to Enroute and Terminal, it’s almost like they’re intentionally letting more people pass. But then if half these kids are washing out at their first facilities, it completely defeats the purpose.
Id be curious to see the facility training data on this hiring track. The Academy pass rates have been insane compared to Enroute and Terminal, it’s almost like they’re intentionally letting more people pass. But then if half these kids are washing out at their first facilities, it completely defeats the purpose.
Our facility, personally, is 2/5 right now. One is done with radar and is training in the tower, the other just started her 3rd radar position and is doing well. 2 of the washouts didn't make it out of SIMs (1 was terminated the other went into the NEST), the 3rd was terminated after being unsuccessful in certifying on 1 radar position - less than 2 weeks away from being off of probation.
The big issue with IQTR is the graduates come in with no basic fundamentals in ATC. 8s/9s are better suited to training techniques on running traffic in a particular airspace
They aren't designed teach trainees things like proper phraseology and how to radar identify somebody, etc. Not allowing them to train in the tower environment first isn't doing them any favors. There are obvious exceptions and better trainees but its really not a good hiring track that sets people up for any kind of success.
Id be curious to see the facility training data on this hiring track. The Academy pass rates have been insane compared to Enroute and Terminal, it’s almost like they’re intentionally letting more people pass. But then if half these kids are washing out at their first facilities, it completely defeats the purpose.
The military faces the same pitfall when career field staffing sucks. Some officer tells a lower ranking officer to fix it so they lower standards some at the ATC school house. Everytime it just results in more peeps washing at first facilities and changes nothing lol. What a paradox.
The big issue with IQTR is the graduates come in with no basic fundamentals in ATC. 8s/9s are better suited to training techniques on running traffic in a particular airspace
They aren't designed teach trainees things like proper phraseology and how to radar identify somebody, etc. Not allowing them to train in the tower environment first isn't doing them any favors. There are obvious exceptions and better trainees but it’s really not a good hiring track that sets people up for any kind of success.
Hell, it’s the FAA. They don’t care about setting anyone up for success, even themselves.
We had that for sure, now absolutely none of the low level up/downs can release thanks to this scheme called CRWG. And then the agency wants to send OTS hires to 8s & 9s because they’re somehow systemically disadvantaged to get staffing so a specially tailored academy pipeline was created just for them… make this fucking make sense.
Would you like a fork, or a spoon to eat your words with?
CRWG is dead: long live CWP I guess. Make this fucking make sense? Am I doing it right? Idk wtf is happening