Being told I have to retake the MMPI-2 twice in eight months, looking for input.

Lol nah man I love working with people. Currently do a work from home gig, the pay is great but I miss bullshitting with a crew. Also come from the Marines so I definitely enjoy the team aspect. I honestly think I failed because I didn't take the MMPI serious enough coming back. Funny how everyone says to don't over think it. Which is exactly what I did this time, I just clicked through with a chip on my shoulder I guess. "Been there done that, let me back in now" ...but yeah still waiting on the govt to process my shit.

Mmpi is garbage. They need bodies, and they still utilize this archaic ass test that many professionals have said is useless. And for what? 99% of people get approved after waiting 2 years to see the shrink. So they weed out maybe 1 or 2 people a year who are probably NOT the next Ted Bundy. -- privatization? I'll take 2, thanks

semperfly said:

Lol nah man I love working with people. Currently do a work from home gig, the pay is great but I miss bullshitting with a crew. Also come from the Marines so I definitely enjoy the team aspect. I honestly think I failed because I didn't take the MMPI serious enough coming back. Funny how everyone says to don't over think it. Which is exactly what I did this time, I just clicked through with a chip on my shoulder I guess. "Been there done that, let me back in now" ...but yeah still waiting on the govt to process my shit.

Mmpi is garbage. They need bodies, and they still utilize this archaic ass test that many professionals have said is useless. And for what? 99% of people get approved after waiting 2 years to see the shrink. So they weed out maybe 1 or 2 people a year who are probably NOT the next Ted Bundy. -- privatization? I'll take 2, thanks

Did the same exact thing, my brother who works at Newark told me to just answer quickly and don’t overthink and I’ll be fine. I did exactly that and failed. What gets me is I had some issues with my driving record and the FAA wanted me to see my own shrink, long story short she had me retake the MMPI-2 along with a whole other battery of tests and in her report said I scored fine. I ANSWERED THE SAME EXACT WAY I DID WHEN I FIRST TOOK IT.

Its a stupid test, 100%. The FAA is hurting so bad and for people like us who are good to go with experience have to deal with this dumb sh*t. They prefer to higher people off the street with no experience and spend thousands to train and most of them don’t even graduate the academy. Most of the rest don’t certify at their first facility. Waste of time, money, and resources. I’ve also heard most of the people who apply don’t even show up to the academy. Not saying everyone with no experience is not going to make it but come on. You have to wanna do this job and put the time in to get good at it. I feel you man, in the same boat as you, march 22nd will be one year of waiting for me no evaluation yet. Hope your process gets going.

There really is an interesting trend of people who fail the MMPI complaining about how stupid/unfair it is... and people who fail the security investigation complaining about how stupid/unfair that process is... and then those who fail the medical clearance complaining about how that process is stupid/unfair as well.

NN9419 said:

There really is an interesting trend of people who fail the MMPI complaining about how stupid/unfair it is... and people who fail the security investigation complaining about how stupid/unfair that process is... and then those who fail the medical clearance complaining about how that process is stupid/unfair as well.

I literally just said I took it twice, answered the SAME exact way. I was told I failed or have been flagged the first time then on the second one I was told I scored fine and no flags were raised. Lol it’s flawed.

YazSW said:

I literally just said I took it twice, answered the SAME exact way. I was told I failed or have been flagged the first time then on the second one I was told I scored fine and no flags were raised. Lol it’s flawed.

The MMPI is a screening tool, it’s not intended to be perfect. Obviously it’s not feasible to require each and every applicant to go through a full psych exam with a Dr., so they use this test to help determine who MIGHT need further examination. Most people who go through tier 2 do end up being cleared, but they need a way to screen people quickly, thus where the MMPI comes into play.

NN9419 said:

The MMPI is a screening tool, it’s not intended to be perfect. Obviously it’s not feasible to require each and every applicant to go through a full psych exam with a Dr., so they use this test to help determine who MIGHT need further examination. Most people who go through tier 2 do end up being cleared, but they need a way to screen people quickly, thus where the MMPI comes into play.

I understand that sir, I really do. You’re right, but maybe try to improve on the process of the actual “tier-2 screening”?

How could you possibly know that you answered everything the exact same way

Maintainvfr said:

How could you possibly know that you answered everything the exact same way

It’s true-false, most of the questions I know I would only answer one way and I remembered most of my previous answers.

YazSW said:

Did the same exact thing, my brother who works at Newark told me to just answer quickly and don’t overthink and I’ll be fine. I did exactly that and failed. What gets me is I had some issues with my driving record and the FAA wanted me to see my own shrink, long story short she had me retake the MMPI-2 along with a whole other battery of tests and in her report said I scored fine. I ANSWERED THE SAME EXACT WAY I DID WHEN I FIRST TOOK IT.

Its a stupid test, 100%. The FAA is hurting so bad and for people like us who are good to go with experience have to deal with this dumb sh*t. They prefer to higher people off the street with no experience and spend thousands to train and most of them don’t even graduate the academy. Most of the rest don’t certify at their first facility. Waste of time, money, and resources. I’ve also heard most of the people who apply don’t even show up to the academy. Not saying everyone with no experience is not going to make it but come on. You have to wanna do this job and put the time in to get good at it. I feel you man, in the same boat as you, march 22nd will be one year of waiting for me no evaluation yet. Hope your process gets going.

You use most a lot. I do not think that word means what you think it means.
And as for prior experience, the two dumbest people I have ever met came in prior experience. Both washed. Not to say the system is not flawed, because it is in almost every aspect.

RavenYZF-R6 said:

You use most a lot. I do not think that word means what you think it means.
And as for prior experience, the two dumbest people I have ever met came in prior experience. Both washed. Not to say the system is not flawed, because it is in almost every aspect.

Well that’s your experience. I’ve had co-workers that used to be instructors at the academy and friends who worked the RPO jobs and this is what I’ve been told. If someone applies to a bid and gets through it to just not show up at the end because they didn’t read the announcement carefully is ridiculous because he/she just wasted a slot for a more potential candidate that actually wants to be a ATC.

NN9419 said:

There really is an interesting trend of people who fail the MMPI complaining about how stupid/unfair it is... and people who fail the security investigation complaining about how stupid/unfair that process is... and then those who fail the medical clearance complaining about how that process is stupid/unfair as well.

I'm pretty sure anyone failing a test like that would have some choice words. I wouldn't fry your circuitry trying to figure out if this is a "trend" or not. We get it, you need validation by taking the self righteous route. Congratulations. Get out of the MMPI thread with that dorky shit.

semperfly said:

I'm pretty sure anyone failing a test like that would have some choice words. I wouldn't fry your circuitry trying to figure out if this is a "trend" or not. We get it, you need validation by taking the self righteous route. Congratulations. Get out of the MMPI thread with that dorky shit.

I can understand where that gentleman is coming from, but waiting 2+ years to see the doctor is crazy. There needs to be something done of how they proceed with this process and how they move the tier-2 candidates along. The agency is hurting right now and this doesn’t help. Especially when almost everyone clears it but has to wait years.

Bro no need to be formal, your boy tail numbers is the kind of guy at work who is always ready to remind people to be grateful yet is the first to complain and file a grievance about the sofa in the break room having a broken leg.

I worked for the govt for most of my life, many of those years in the FAA. Let's be real a lot of the shit the govt does is excessively complicated just to create jobs. It's a numbers game.

Also the post above regarding the MMPI being a useful screening tool is pretty weak in my opinion. Considering almost everyone who's ever posted about their failure on .65 or SM ended up passing when seeing the shrink. I assume that those figures remain the same for people who don't post online as well. So who is it really weeding out? Sounds like another sweet contract gig for the people who weaseled their way into that setup.

Flagging on the MMPI requiring further evaluation isn't the problem. The problem is that the tier 2 process ranges anywhere from 4 months to 4 years. No rhyme or reason and in almost every case applicants are approved. Or if they aren't, they're denied, it's appealed at great cost to the applicant only for the federal air surgeon to grant an exempt medical for that applicant.

It's archaic and broken. I come from an analyst background government, military and civilian. Like most things in the government, a simple process mapping would improve the system by months or even years in some cases.

[removed]

NN9419 said:

There really is an interesting trend of people who fail the MMPI complaining about how stupid/unfair it is...

Look at all of his previous posts. Always ready to tell people they need to just tough it out. Suck it up. Get over it. You're lucky to have this opportunity.

Yet there is no doubt in my mind it's the same person who complains about every little thing in the work environment. We've all dealt with these people before.

This is the kind of person everyone secretly doesn't want showing up to the union BBQs.

It's unfortunate this wannabe macho attitude exists too. Because we ARE lucky enough to work in an industry with a strong union, and generally intelligent people compared to a lot of other careers. If you want to fix the system, conversations like this need to occur. Eventually if enough noise is made, maybe we can help fix this mismanagement of tax payer money. 1- 4 years is ridiculously negligent. During this time a long list of people are making large salaries related to the MMPI. For what? Who is it truly weeding out? So far I haven't heard of a single person who didn't end up making it. -- but yeah, just stop "complaining".

semperfly said:

100% agree. But don't say that to people like NN9419.

Look at all of his previous posts. Always ready to tell people they need to just tough it out. Suck it up. Get over it. You're lucky to have this opportunity.

Yet there is no doubt in my mind it's the same person who complains about every little thing in the work environment. We've all dealt with these people before.

This is the kind of person everyone secretly doesn't want showing up to the union BBQs.

It's unfortunate this wannabe macho attitude exists too. Because we ARE lucky enough to work in an industry with a strong union, and generally intelligent people compared to a lot of other careers. If you want to fix the system, conversations like this need to occur. Eventually if enough noise is made, maybe we can help fix this mismanagement of tax payer money. 1- 4 years is ridiculously negligent. During this time a long list of people are making large salaries related to the MMPI. For what? Who is it truly weeding out? So far I haven't heard of a single person who didn't end up making it. -- but yeah, just stop "complaining".

I've heard of DQs... I've also heard of every single one being successfully appealed.

NN9419, reminds me of the senior NCO back in my day crowd. Because it sucked for them it should have to suck for everyone else. When leadership 101 is to always leave a place better than you found it.

semperfly said:

Look at all of his previous posts. Always ready to tell people they need to just tough it out. Suck it up. Get over it. You're lucky to have this opportunity.

Yet there is no doubt in my mind it's the same person who complains about every little thing in the work environment. We've all dealt with these people before.

This is the kind of person everyone secretly doesn't want showing up to the union BBQs.

It's unfortunate this wannabe macho attitude exists too. Because we ARE lucky enough to work in an industry with a strong union, and generally intelligent people compared to a lot of other careers. If you want to fix the system, conversations like this need to occur. Eventually if enough noise is made, maybe we can help fix this mismanagement of tax payer money. 1- 4 years is ridiculously negligent. During this time a long list of people are making large salaries related to the MMPI. For what? Who is it truly weeding out? So far I haven't heard of a single person who didn't end up making it. -- but yeah, just stop "complaining".

Relax dude, he said that everyone that fails thinks it's unfair. He didn't go on some crazy rant or anything, he didn't even say anything mean. Holy shit do you know this guy and have some bad blood or something?

Yeah, the process is cumbersome and there's obviously room for improvement. Watching everyone that fails it get in a big circlejerk about how terrible it is gets old too. It's one of those things where when you're in it, you feel like it's ruining your life but once it's in the mirror you realize that everyone has to deal with the FAA putting it in your butt at some point. Think of it like them just stretching you out ahead of time so you know what you're in for and the next ones a little easier.

Also, when the guy that started the thread said
"Its a stupid test, 100%. The FAA is hurting so bad and for people like us who are good to go with experience have to deal with this dumb sh*t. They prefer to higher people off the street with no experience and spend thousands to train and most of them don’t even graduate the academy. Most of the rest don’t certify at their first facility. Waste of time, money, and resources."
I guarantee every CPC rolled their eyes. I'm not going to get into the whole military vs OTS debate, especially not with people who aren't even at an FAA facility, but this is ignorant and stupid.

The two or three of you can keep agreeing and liking eachothers posts, but the guy wasn't even an asshole

Maintainvfr said:

Relax dude, he said that everyone that fails thinks it's unfair. He didn't go on some crazy rant or anything, he didn't even say anything mean. Holy shit do you know this guy and have some bad blood or something?

Yeah, the process is cumbersome and there's obviously room for improvement. Watching everyone that fails it get in a big circlejerk about how terrible it is gets old too. It's one of those things where when you're in it, you feel like it's ruining your life but once it's in the mirror you realize that everyone has to deal with the FAA putting it in your butt at some point. Think of it like them just stretching you out ahead of time so you know what you're in for and the next ones a little easier.

Also, when the guy that started the thread said
"Its a stupid test, 100%. The FAA is hurting so bad and for people like us who are good to go with experience have to deal with this dumb sh*t. They prefer to higher people off the street with no experience and spend thousands to train and most of them don’t even graduate the academy. Most of the rest don’t certify at their first facility. Waste of time, money, and resources."
I guarantee every CPC rolled their eyes. I'm not going to get into the whole military vs OTS debate, especially not with people who aren't even at an FAA facility, but this is ignorant and stupid.

The two or three of you can keep agreeing and liking eachothers posts, but the guy wasn't even an asshole

I don't think anyone isn't relaxed. Though there's a clear difference between embracing the suck and crap processes.

Maintainvfr said:

Relax dude, he said that everyone that fails thinks it's unfair. He didn't go on some crazy rant or anything, he didn't even say anything mean. Holy shit do you know this guy and have some bad blood or something?

Yeah, the process is cumbersome and there's obviously room for improvement. Watching everyone that fails it get in a big circlejerk about how terrible it is gets old too. It's one of those things where when you're in it, you feel like it's ruining your life but once it's in the mirror you realize that everyone has to deal with the FAA putting it in your butt at some point. Think of it like them just stretching you out ahead of time so you know what you're in for and the next ones a little easier.

Also, when the guy that started the thread said
"Its a stupid test, 100%. The FAA is hurting so bad and for people like us who are good to go with experience have to deal with this dumb sh*t. They prefer to higher people off the street with no experience and spend thousands to train and most of them don’t even graduate the academy. Most of the rest don’t certify at their first facility. Waste of time, money, and resources."
I guarantee every CPC rolled their eyes. I'm not going to get into the whole military vs OTS debate, especially not with people who aren't even at an FAA facility, but this is ignorant and stupid.

The two or three of you can keep agreeing and liking eachothers posts, but the guy wasn't even an asshole

What?! Everyone knows PE's are the best controllers in the agency across the board. They never suck donkey dick and always certify and are always the most effective controllers at their facility.

Maintainvfr said:

Relax dude, he said that everyone that fails thinks it's unfair. He didn't go on some crazy rant or anything, he didn't even say anything mean. Holy shit do you know this guy and have some bad blood or something?

Yeah, the process is cumbersome and there's obviously room for improvement. Watching everyone that fails it get in a big circlejerk about how terrible it is gets old too. It's one of those things where when you're in it, you feel like it's ruining your life but once it's in the mirror you realize that everyone has to deal with the FAA putting it in your butt at some point. Think of it like them just stretching you out ahead of time so you know what you're in for and the next ones a little easier.

Also, when the guy that started the thread said
"Its a stupid test, 100%. The FAA is hurting so bad and for people like us who are good to go with experience have to deal with this dumb sh*t. They prefer to higher people off the street with no experience and spend thousands to train and most of them don’t even graduate the academy. Most of the rest don’t certify at their first facility. Waste of time, money, and resources."
I guarantee every CPC rolled their eyes. I'm not going to get into the whole military vs OTS debate, especially not with people who aren't even at an FAA facility, but this is ignorant and stupid.

The two or three of you can keep agreeing and liking eachothers posts, but the guy wasn't even an asshole

No one is asking to debate, numbers don’t lie. This is factual. What I said is happening very often. It is a waste of resources. As far as the MMPI-2, I agreed with that gentleman, I said he’s right but the process needs reform for sure. So you can roll your eyes all you want but I haven’t said anything untrue.

I have nothing against OTS candidates, I know plenty of them and they became outstanding controllers.