Changing areas
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FightingIrish2012
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Some centers that developed a big imbalance in staffing between areas would offer a little incentive (crazy little, 1K-2K) for people to change areas to understaffed ones.
But why would you ever want to unless you are training and washing out? And if you are washing out NATCA will never allow it even if you are clearly in the hardest area and you would succeed in another one.
That would be a tiny step in admitting that one area or sector might be harder then another, therefore taking a tiny swipe at the “one roof one pay” model, so they will just let you wash and be condemned to a level five shithole.
But why would you ever want to unless you are training and washing out? And if you are washing out NATCA will never allow it even if you are clearly in the hardest area and you would succeed in another one.
That would be a tiny step in admitting that one area or sector might be harder then another, therefore taking a tiny swipe at the “one roof one pay” model, so they will just let you wash and be condemned to a level five shithole.
While the pay might suck, you would be surprised how often lower level facilities aren’t “shitholes” and are actually some of the best working environments in the NAS….I know of a few low level towers that people transfer to after getting a couple of high three years in a 10,11,12. Then ride out the rest of their years with their feet up on the counter taking leave whenever they want.
HenryTheAce
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Honestly… that sounds miserably boring day in and day out though. I’d rifle through all my leave just twiddling my thumbs while there. I get your point though.
TT4019
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Coming from a low level shithole that moves no traffic day in and day out, it’s terrible and not recommended. I wake up and my first thought is do I want to go waste the next 8 hours of my day or take a fuck it day and bang in. We sit and do absolutely nothing on and off position. More controllers on position than we have A/C in the airspace or even expected. So all you hear all day is gossip and endless complaints about the dumbest shit.
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Befor COVID19 my center had 2 or 3 people that were going to 100% wash out change areas. They were all successful too. Some areas have shit trainers or simply don't train trainees on a regular enough basis for the trainees to be successful. That is the difference I've seen. It's obvious every area in a center isn't going to have the same traffic. ATC isn't a cookie cutter operation. But it would be very difficult to claim one area is 2 levels harder than another in the same building working airspace pretty much next to each other. Maybe 1 level harder. But not two. And if it's only one level harder it's honestly not worth it. That is simply my opinion though
Raise when?
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It’s a non issue
A good trainee will not wash out of any area. It’s only the ones who suck or will be, at best, mediocre controllers for the rest of their careers who have to worry about this lol
32andBelow
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It’s true. But of course the FAA rarely uses nuance to match people’s ability with the areas. You also have amazing trainees/controllers just wasting away in extremely easy areas.
I don't know about that. I see controllers that did or were gonna wash in another area doing great work now. They are solid controllers as CPCs. I agree that some trainees are "super stars" and would have no problem regardless. But not every trainee a super star. Agree to disagree because I've seen it.
Other than previous experience it's hard to tell who is going to be good and who isn't till they start working live traffic. Test scores, academy scores, even the lab isn't like live traffic. Then you have "easy areas" that have that one difficult sector. You still have to get every sector to certify. That's why I think easy areas and hard areas at least at centers is exaggerated. I get mega TRACONs because you can be feeding a level 8 airport vs a level 11 or 12 airport in the same building. But in a center. Every area has at least one sector that can get busy and/or complex throughout a shift. Now some areas have more of those types of sectors than others and the daily work load can be harder. But from a training standpoint, it's all or nothing
slater
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Not everyone should be a teacher (OJT), just because they passed the class once. IMO one of the agencies biggest silent struggles. In the end the process couldn't possibly be an issue, only the trainee?
Anyone who puts it on the solely on the trainee specifically, likely has children who are raised with daddy (or mommy) issues and got that tattoo you don't know about.
Anyone who puts it on the solely on the trainee specifically, likely has children who are raised with daddy (or mommy) issues and got that tattoo you don't know about.
I definitely agree. Who's on your training team and who your supervisor is plays a HUGE factor in a trainees succes, if they get certified and how long their training takes. That's why changing areas can make a big difference, for those reasons alone
32andBelow
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Depends on the center. Some work a lot of airports and some do mainly overflights. You can tell if a trainee can handle the high sectors with minimal difficulty but struggle with airport traffic. But we usually just wash them out as opposed to kicking them across the hallway.
I definitely agree. Who your training team and supervisor are plays a HUGE factor in a trainees succes, if they get certified and h
My area has really busy low altitude sectors with a ton of small airports, and sequencing to a really busy airport. The high side is a little easier with the ultra highs. But the high is a beast. We actually started putting trainees on the lows 1st if possible because people felt starting them on the ultra highs was a waste of time because no one washes on the ultra highs. I thought that was kinda jacked up lol
