Nothanks said:Maybe they don’t think it’s a long term solution.
One would like to think so, but the numbers do not lie. Attrition through medical, washouts, hardships, and priority releases almost guarantee this will be permanent unless something better is “discovered.”
SunnyATC said:Don’t suck at the academy and get a level 8 off the bat.
This would have been useful a decade ago. Kind of.
Then my narrative could have been about how I’m trapped at an 8 up/down instead of a level 7.
This will spread out the new hires from 4-12 and make NCEPT more competitive if the 8-9’s are staffed better.
SunnyATC said:Don’t suck at the academy and get a level 8 off the bat.
And then you can be stuck there for your entire career
GulfCharlie said:One would like to think so, but the numbers do not lie. Attrition through medical, washouts, hardships, and priority releases almost guarantee this will be permanent unless something better is “discovered.”
It’s an improvement. And yet people still aren’t happy. We work for the federal govt, shit ain’t perfect
Nothanks said:It’s an improvement. And yet people still aren’t happy. We work for the federal govt, shit ain’t perfect
Not denying that, but we both know how this will end.
HurryUpandWait said:Is it liable for a lawsuit for denying career progression?
Not in this circumstance, but in theory yes they can be held liable. That’s why they exclude facility pay levels from being considered “career progression” and also why they DO NOT tell applicants an explicit reason as to why you’re not selected for bids. You can use that against them and they know it.
GulfCharlie said:The disagreement involved the agency thinking this is a long term solution when it is not. It is a solution yes, on that much we agree, but not one that will allow movement for those 7 and under. That is the disagreement, not with you or your character.
4-7s absolutely dominate the data for controllers released via NCEPT. It’s not even close.
The most common complaint from 8-9 BUEs trying to move is “we’re getting skipped by the 4-7s”.
And they’re right.
The most common complaint from 10-12 selecting facilities is “my list sucks because it’s all 4-7s”.
This is more complicated but they’re basically also right.
Move78 said:4-7s absolutely dominate the data for controllers released via NCEPT. It’s not even close.
The most common complaint from 8-9 BUEs trying to move is “we’re getting skipped by the 4-7s”.
And they’re right.The most common complaint from 10-12 selecting facilities is “my list sucks because it’s all 4-7s”.
This is more complicated but they’re basically also right.
I’ll admit I misworded that, apologies, my meaning involved 8/9’s not being able to move. Multiple conversations going on.
GulfCharlie said:I’ll admit I misworded that, apologies, my meaning involved 8/9’s not being able to move. Multiple conversations going on.
The answer is more priority bids or lower the 85% staffing requirement to release. All the facilities are already understaffed and once they get close they deviate from the floor for management, SS, etc
ncssailor said:What other agencies are openly denying career progression I want to know. This sounds like a class action lawsuit…..they deny Sup Promotions left and right which is also career progression. What value does NATCA even have because they are turning their backs on us.
It’s fucking bullshit, what they get away with.
They deny sup bids among others all the time and when someone actually inquires with the HR rep about why they weren’t selected, the regional managers always say the same BS “we did not find the applicant to be most qualified of those who applied” blah…blah…blah… As long as they don’t say because of your current facility’s staffing they’re covered and no grievance can be filed for denying career progression. The FAA’s whole hiring system and the way it’s setup is a complete and total scam.
HurryUpandWait said:The answer is more priority bids or lower the 85% staffing requirement to release. All the facilities are already understaffed and once they get close they deviate from the floor for management, SS, etc
I feel like they’ll have to address the 85% national average release threshold before long. So far they have not presented one permanent solution to the staffing or placement issues we face.
SquawkHijack said:I feel like they’ll have to address the 85% national average release threshold before long. So far they have not presented one permanent solution to the staffing or placement issues we face.
We need to apply the pressure to ensure they do. They think they are doing a good job
SquawkHijack said:All in all I don’t think HR is accounting for the CPC resignations for those who continue to grow tired of the bullshit.
There were like 15 on the last cwp I read
Phillytroll69 said:There were like 15 on the last cwp I read
Big numbers
The amount of CPCs who want to transfer to 8/9 updowns as a first choice is low. So I don't blame the FAA for trying to figure something out. But a major part of the problem is the nature of NCEPT itself. It's too hard to move so why waste a move on a mid level? The FAA has to either acknowledge that the terminal level requires a farm system, which requires movement. Or NATCA needs to have them flatten the pay scales since they seem to think everyone is doing the same job.
Soul_Controller said:The amount of CPCs who want to transfer to 8/9 updowns as a first choice is low. So I don't blame the FAA for trying to figure something out. But a major part of the problem is the nature of NCEPT itself. It's too hard to move so why waste a move on a mid level? The FAA has to either acknowledge that the terminal level requires a farm system, which requires movement. Or NATCA needs to have them flatten the pay scales since they seem to think everyone is doing the same job.
That is important to note, I know I made the mistake going to a mid-level facility before bidding a 12 but that set me back by 4 years. People learn and watch from others and the mantra is "go big or go home."
Is it crazy to want to go from a 12 to a 9 for QOL reasons?
twn said:Is it crazy to want to go from a 12 to a 9 for QOL reasons?
It is not, just when you start you career out thinking you need to go 7->9->12.
twn said:Is it crazy to want to go from a 12 to a 9 for QOL reasons?
Absolutely not. I submit that any career decision to improve quality of life should not be called crazy.
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