Best NY towers to work at

[Mike Kilo]

I don't see how JFK could be a 9. Decent traffic volume, moderately complex runway layout, large mix AC types, having to deal with N90 and other new yorkers, huge quantities foreign pilots that barely speak English... Maybe not 11 numbers but intuitively I don't see how they go below a 10 especially when easier operations like MSP went from 11->10 recently.

Soon to be 9. Just like DTW. It’s a kick in the nuts to other facilities that are below the band and get cut.

 

[Wizard]

7 vfr towers probably working 2x as hard as these places

 

[I.DO.VEHCTAHS]

JFK runs the most ops per day every day. Not to mention they ran 5mil MORE pax than EWR in 2022. Not going to be downgraded anytime soon folks.

 

[rhombus]

JFK runs the most ops per day every day. Not to mention they ran 5mil MORE pax than EWR in 2022. Not going to be downgraded anytime soon folks.

I agree JFK won’t and shouldn’t get downgraded if it continues it’s current numbers. But EWR does more ops than JFK. JFK’s CBA position is a joke compared to EWR and even LGA. And passenger count is a useless metric for air traffic purposes

 

[32andBelow]

They got y’all arguing about downgrading places instead of arguing for lower places to make more. Knock it off

 

[rhombus]

They got y’all arguing about downgrading places instead of arguing for lower places to make more. Knock it off

Yea maybe we shouldn’t talk about the relative difficulty of NY area towers in a thread about the relative difficulty of NY area towers. Makes sense

 

[32andBelow]

Yea maybe we shouldn’t talk about the relative difficulty of NY area towers in a thread about the relative difficulty of NY area towers. Makes sense

I seen it all over this site people saying places should get downgraded

 

[PrisonMike]

I seen it all over this site people saying places should get downgraded

Centers should get downgraded.

 

[CoffeeIV]

passenger count is a useless metric for air traffic purposes

It shouldn't though considering that the FAA is largely funded by the Airport and Airway Trust Fund. The fees passengers pay to fly pay us. If anything, it should be a huge point by NATCA to argue for our salaries in the future since airlines have gotten larger planes and have more passengers than ever but less operations resulting in downgrades.

 

[I.DO.VEHCTAHS]

I agree JFK won’t and shouldn’t get downgraded if it continues it’s current numbers. But EWR does more ops than JFK. JFK’s CBA position is a joke compared to EWR and even LGA. And passenger count is a useless metric for air traffic purposes

Faa ops data doesn’t support that

 

[rhombus]

It shouldn't though considering that the FAA is largely funded by the Airport and Airway Trust Fund. The fees passengers pay to fly pay us. If anything, it should be a huge point by NATCA to argue for our salaries in the future since airlines have gotten larger planes and have more passengers than ever but less operations resulting in downgrades.

The thing is, that’s been happening all over the NAS, not just at facilities getting downgraded. If you look at a place like DTW, there’s essentially zero difference in the number of passengers in 2000 vs the number of passengers in 2019. They do not have ‘more passengers than ever’. They stagnated before the pandemic when many airports were seeing record passenger flow. The airports that haven’t been downgraded have seen a steady increase in passenger count in the last 20 years and have seen an increase or at least stable traffic counts to go along with it.

Also good luck convincing any VFR tower that doesn’t have measurable passenger counts that you should keep your pay for doing less work just because there are more faces/plane nowadays.

 

[Wizard]

JFK runs the most ops per day every day. Not to mention they ran 5mil MORE pax than EWR in 2022. Not going to be downgraded anytime soon folks.

JFK was under the threshold to be downgraded for 10 years then magically got reset recently

 

[rhombus]

Faa ops data doesn’t support that

Here’s some FAA Ops Data that shows EWR breaking 500,000 ops every year in the last 10 years aside from 2020 and 2021. JFK cracked 500,000 zero times

 

[I.DO.VEHCTAHS]

Here’s some FAA Ops Data that shows EWR breaking 500,000 ops every year in the last 10 years aside from 2020 and 2021. JFK cracked 500,000 zero times
View attachment 8539

1/1/22-12/31/22…This is straight from aspm.faa.gov

 

[Wizard]

Never thought I’d see the day when people argue about towers that are two levels higher than they should be.