Remedy for not being given normal NEST facility list?

Dolan

Trusted Contributor
Messages
326
I see what your saying but I know it was once written up somewhere that you would be given a list of every facility your qualified for that has a vacancy. That’s why so many people are still under that impression. Maybe it did change now but it used to be the other way and if it changed it wasn’t well communicated.

It's right here on this site:


Maybe that page needs to get changed? Althought I think that graphic comes directly from NATCA...
 

Fiore

Member
Messages
17
Hey just a brief update, getting a lawyer paid off in spades. I can't go into a lot of detail but contesting this issue improved my outcome tenfold.

The agency is absolutely obligated to offer all facilities with vacancies as previously discussed and I encourage anyone else who they try to break the rules with to seek legal help
 

Gusher

Active Member
Messages
105
Hey just a brief update, getting a lawyer paid off in spades. I can't go into a lot of detail but contesting this issue improved my outcome tenfold.

The agency is absolutely obligated to offer all facilities with vacancies as previously discussed and I encourage anyone else who they try to break the rules with to seek legal help
Glad it worked out. However I would be pissed at the Union for not fighting on your behalf. That’s what they are here to do, so you don’t have to pay for a lawyer to deal with ‘employee rights’ issues.
 

FL747

Member
Messages
39
Kinda glad to have that upheld. Up until now, our locale has revolved around my SO's options. We'll watch to see how everything unfolds - if her paycheck isn't as stable as we expected, maybe it's time to properly consider some of my options.
 

GulfCharlie

Comrade Commissar
FAA
Messages
1,007
Facility
BNA Nashville Tower
Hey just a brief update, getting a lawyer paid off in spades. I can't go into a lot of detail but contesting this issue improved my outcome tenfold.

The agency is absolutely obligated to offer all facilities with vacancies as previously discussed and I encourage anyone else who they try to break the rules with to seek legal help
Post the name of the lawyer for future individuals
 

bravoindia

Trusted Contributor
FAA
Messages
208
Facility
Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center
You need to fight this, try to get the RVP involved, they might ignore you and your Fac Rep will hate you for going above their head but it is too important a life changing event to let it go. You are 100% you should be offered every vacancy level 6 and below facility (unless that was abolished in the back door deal and not announced). Maybe the Fac Rep and ATM at your old facility can help if you had a good relationship and want to go back there. Try to find the exact verbiage regarding this on the KSN website, they stripped lots of the info on the NEST pages but the original MOUs should still be there.
Def go to the RVP and who cares if the Facrep hates you if they’re not fighting for you on this anyway they’re not worth the title.
 

Phillytroll69

Trusted Contributor
FAA
Messages
184
Facility
JNU Juneau Tower
Post the name of the lawyer for future individuals
Your honor,
The only qualifying languagein the contract is AND.

'the employee will be provided a list of facilities in which be qualifies AND a vacancy exists'

The list is facilities for which you qualify (6 and below)
Less than 100% staffing

I think you could also find one and have them request you.

It doesn't say the FAA or union picks out of facilities you qualify, it says (implied all) facilities you qualify

The other proof is right above where it mentions up to 5 facilities,

If it were meant to be a limited list the contract would have stated, as seen above
 

edds93

Trusted Contributor
Messages
205
If it were meant to be a limited list the contract would have stated, as seen above
If it were meant to be an unlimited list, the contract would state ALL facilities at which you qualify. See, it works both ways. Basically what this thread is saying is if you're certified at a shitty 6 in bfe and really want to get back home to the 6 in your hometown but that would basically be impossible because it will never be a high priority ncept facility and there's a lot of competition to get out of your shitty level 6, then go ahead and bid every level 7 and above in the country when ncept rolls around. Sure, you might get picked up at shitty 'ol EWR, but not to worry because you can just withdraw from training and tell the FAA you want to go sit on the beaches of SRQ because there's an opening down there and you're entitled to. Sounds like a crock of shit to me. Congrats to OP though, I'm sure the FAA just caved because they lawyered up and it's a lot easier than going to court.
 

boots

Forum Sage
Messages
507
If it were meant to be an unlimited list, the contract would state ALL facilities at which you qualify. See, it works both ways. Basically what this thread is saying is if you're certified at a shitty 6 in bfe and really want to get back home to the 6 in your hometown but that would basically be impossible because it will never be a high priority ncept facility and there's a lot of competition to get out of your shitty level 6, then go ahead and bid every level 7 and above in the country when ncept rolls around. Sure, you might get picked up at shitty 'ol EWR, but not to worry because you can just withdraw from training and tell the FAA you want to go sit on the beaches of SRQ because there's an opening down there and you're entitled to. Sounds like a crock of shit to me. Congrats to OP though, I'm sure the FAA just caved because they lawyered up and it's a lot easier than going to court.
dont think you can just withdrawl but thats not really the point.
 

JNev

Forum Sage
FAA
Messages
570
Facility
BWI Baltimore Tower
If it were meant to be an unlimited list, the contract would state ALL facilities at which you qualify. See, it works both ways. Basically what this thread is saying is if you're certified at a shitty 6 in bfe and really want to get back home to the 6 in your hometown but that would basically be impossible because it will never be a high priority ncept facility and there's a lot of competition to get out of your shitty level 6, then go ahead and bid every level 7 and above in the country when ncept rolls around. Sure, you might get picked up at shitty 'ol EWR, but not to worry because you can just withdraw from training and tell the FAA you want to go sit on the beaches of SRQ because there's an opening down there and you're entitled to. Sounds like a crock of shit to me. Congrats to OP though, I'm sure the FAA just caved because they lawyered up and it's a lot easier than going to court.
Yea man I just feel bad for the FAA getting bullied by the mean ol controller's lawyer!
 

Shikaka

Legendary Member
Messages
1,757
dont think you can just withdrawl but thats not really the point.
What's stopping you? Whether you go thru all your hours or terminate your own training, you still go to the nest

Failures and Withdrawals receive different lists, withdrawals get the shorter list of select facilities (5 in total). A withdrawal wouldn't help secure a "country club" but a termination would.
 

edds93

Trusted Contributor
Messages
205
Failures and Withdrawals receive different lists, withdrawals get the shorter list of select facilities (5 in total). A withdrawal wouldn't help secure a "country club" but a termination would.
Is the language different for withdrawls? Why can't a withdrawal also just lawyer up and get an extended list. It doesn't say in the contract withdrawals get a short, shitty list that they might not like, right?
 

Shikaka

Legendary Member
Messages
1,757
Is the language different for withdrawls? Why can't a withdrawal also just lawyer up and get an extended list. It doesn't say in the contract withdrawals get a short, shitty list that they might not like, right?

The NEST SOP dictates the shorter list, no chance in layering up for that.
 

edds93

Trusted Contributor
Messages
205
The NEST SOP dictates the shorter list, no chance in layering up for that.
Disregard, found the SOP which shows I am indeed mistaken. My apologies. Still think it's a crock of shit that if you wash, then they are forced to give you a list of ALL facilities, country clubs included.
 

Shikaka

Legendary Member
Messages
1,757
Disregard, found the SOP which shows I am indeed mistaken. My apologies. Still think it's a crock of shit that if you wash, then they are forced to give you a list of ALL facilities, country clubs included.

Also look up Article 61 in the CBA.
 

Homsar

Trusted Contributor
Messages
215
Still think it's a crock of shit that if you wash, then they are forced to give you a list of ALL facilities, country clubs included.

That’s clearly stated in the contract...

Section 3. If an employee, who was previously facility certified, transfers and fails to achieve full certification in his/her new facility, he/she will be provided a list of facilities for which he/she qualifies and where a vacancy exists. The employee will select one for reassignment. This list may include the employee's previous facility if a vacancy exists.


If there’s a facility under 100% staffing, a vacancy exists at that facility.
 

jyouse

Lurker
Messages
4
From the NEST SOP
"If the decision by the Air Traffic Vice President or designee is to retain the employee as a 2152 Air Traffic Control Specialist at a Terminal, En Route facility or Flight Service Station, AJG- P21 POC will:
1.8.1 Create Article 61 Job Search Memorandum and prepare a vacancy lists based on the recommendations from the NEST Panel. This list will include all facilities that fall below the national projected future CPC to target and vacancies available at Flight Service Stations, and 2154 positions as applicable.
1.8.1.1 When it is determined that there are more employees recommended for retention at the Tower FPL-7 and below level than facilities available at the Projected National Average, we will increase the list by capturing facilities national projected future CPC to Target plus one percent. We will continue to increase by increments of one percent until there are enough facilities for each employee recommended for Tower FPL-7 and below."
All I'm seeing here is that the vacancy lists will include "all facilities that fall below the national projected future CPC to target". What does the national projected future CPC to target mean? does this mean the national average of projected CPC to target? The only thing I see on the SOP is that fastracking back to your old facility is guaranteed unless it is under 100%
 
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