Shoot The Breeze

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Phillyman2633 said:
I mean, you dont have to wait for a socialist to get elected president to donate your paychecks to welfare programs...grab that big ole dick-shaped commie baton by the horns and be a trailblazer, lead the way by example
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And you don't have to wait for a libertarian to take over to hit the private sector for that supremo job security and retirement.

See I can make bad faith arguments too bruh.
 
Nhstadt said:
And you don't have to wait for a libertarian to take over to hit the private sector for that supremo job security and retirement.

See I can make bad faith arguments too bruh.
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The difference being that Bernie Sanders, and socialism by definition, strive to "create equality" that naturally would not (nor should not) otherwise exist by funding extravagant federal programs and diluting the merit of labor by forcible redistribution of wealth, ostensibly arguing by default the majority of people in the work force would not otherwise care to fund these programs voluntarily.

My personal belief that most instances of government excesses would be solved by "true" privatization does not preclude my taking advantage of a situation presented me by taking a job.

Inadequate comparison my guy.
 
Phillyman2633 said:
The difference being that Bernie Sanders, and socialism by definition, strive to "create equality" that naturally would not (nor should not) otherwise exist by funding extravagant federal programs and diluting the merit of labor by forcible redistribution of wealth, ostensibly arguing by default the majority of people in the work force would not otherwise care to fund these programs voluntarily.

My personal belief that most instances of government excesses would be solved by "true" privatization does not preclude my taking advantage of a situation presented me by taking a job.

Inadequate comparison my guy.
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Multiple studies show a majority of Americans support some form of government run Healthcare program like the rest of the developed world offers thier citizens (and those citizens with it tend to love it), at much less cost than the American system, among other things regarding gov programs and services.

And I need to look no further than the gilded age to see what "true privatization" looks like for the majority of American workers. That's not something I wish to go back to, and I fear we aren't to far off from entering a digital age version of that. Government regulation keeps greedy scumbags in check. We just need to keep said greedy scumbags out of government and not allow them to influence it so much.

I'm all for the freedumbs portion of libertarianism, but the economic and social policy aspects of it are fucking asinine and ignore not only history, but human nature and greed- much like anyone calling for full on tankie authoritarian communism, which isn't what I or any sane person wants.

So ya, muh roads and shit. Your argument still sucks and is in bad faith.
 
Nhstadt said:
Multiple studies show a majority of Americans support some form of government run Healthcare program like the rest of the developed world offers thier citizens (and those citizens with it tend to love it), at much less cost than the American system, among other things regarding gov programs and services.

And I need to look no further than the gilded age to see what "true privatization" looks like for the majority of American workers. That's not something I wish to go back to, and I fear we aren't to far off from entering a digital age version of that. Government regulation keeps greedy scumbags in check. We just need to keep said greedy scumbags out of government and not allow them to influence it so much.

I'm all for the freedumbs portion of libertarianism, but the economic and social policy aspects of it are fucking asinine and ignore not only history, but human nature and greed- much like anyone calling for full on tankie authoritarian communism, which isn't what I or any sane person wants.

So ya, muh roads and shit. Your argument still sucks and is in bad faith.
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Half the people are already on single payer. You don’t see too many old fucks buying private coverage
 
Nhstadt said:
Multiple studies show a majority of Americans support some form of government run Healthcare program like the rest of the developed world offers thier citizens (and those citizens with it tend to love it), at much less cost than the American system, among other things regarding gov programs and services.

And I need to look no further than the gilded age to see what "true privatization" looks like for the majority of American workers. That's not something I wish to go back to, and I fear we aren't to far off from entering a digital age version of that. Government regulation keeps greedy scumbags in check. We just need to keep said greedy scumbags out of government and not allow them to influence it so much.

I'm all for the freedumbs portion of libertarianism, but the economic and social policy aspects of it are fucking asinine and ignore not only history, but human nature and greed- much like anyone calling for full on tankie authoritarian communism, which isn't what I or any sane person wants.

So ya, muh roads and shit. Your argument still sucks and is in bad faith.
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What the fuck are you talking about dude? You're spouting unsubstantiated nonsense. Have you spoken to anyone from a country with a nationalized healthcare system? Hours-long wait lines in the ERs, getting denied for what are considered normal procedures here in the US...talk to some Canadians and people from the UK and see how wonderful and utopian their system is.

You want to talk about why the US healthcare costs so much money? Government regulations. Tell me why a bag of saline costs $250 at the hospital...probably because of the free market, yeah? Or maybe because of onerous, laborious, and prohibitive certification processes by the FDA? That sounds more on the mark to me.

And you're missing the point, again. You can point to a hundred studies about how 51% of the population supports universal healthcare...but at the expense of everyone else who doesn't care for it. You want to subsidize education (great example of regulated government experience), healthcare, and whatever else, go ahead dude, donate $100 a paycheck to the ASPCA or whatever but where would you care to draw the line for dipping into my pocket?
 
Phillyman2633 said:
What the fuck are you talking about dude? You're spouting unsubstantiated nonsense. Have you spoken to anyone from a country with a nationalized healthcare system? Hours-long wait lines in the ERs, getting denied for what are considered normal procedures here in the US...talk to some Canadians and people from the UK and see how wonderful and utopian their system is.

You want to talk about why the US healthcare costs so much money? Government regulations. Tell me why a bag of saline costs $250 at the hospital...probably because of the free market, yeah? Or maybe because of onerous, laborious, and prohibitive certification processes by the FDA? That sounds more on the mark to me.

And you're missing the point, again. You can point to a hundred studies about how 51% of the population supports universal healthcare...but at the expense of everyone else who doesn't care for it. You want to subsidize education (great example of regulated government experience), healthcare, and whatever else, go ahead dude, donate $100 a paycheck to the ASPCA or whatever but where would you care to draw the line for dipping into my pocket?
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Dude what. People from Europe do not want the US health care system. You cannot be serious.
 
The reason wait times are longer in Canada is because theres more people (per capita) able to access the system. In the US, many people have access to excellent healthcare. In Canada, everyone has access to excellent healthcare. And it’s cheaper and they live longer.
 
32andBelow said:
We are extremely lucky to have our health plans. They certainly aren’t typical
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I literally dont know anyone who is employed and over the age of 25 who doesnt have a decent health plan through their employer. Yeah, maybe their deductible isnt $350, but they're not hurting for coverage.

My wife's brother and sister-in-law are doctors in Canada...yes, it's anecdotal, but they assure me that their nationalized healthcare isn't rainbows and sunshine and chocolate jimmies.
 
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