Enroute Class pass rate

7/23 Enroute

Class Finished 5/11
Picking:
ZDV x2
ZHU
ZID
ZAN

From the ATC New Hiring Discord

7/30 Enroute

Class finished 11/18
Picking:
ZJX
ZAU
ZFW
ZID
ZJX
ZHU
ZTL
ZSE or ZDV
ZDC
ZTl
ZNY or ZHU or ZDV

From the ATC New Hiring Discord

8/5 Enroute

Class finished 7/14
2 ZHU
ZFW
ZAU
ZID
ZLC
ZSE

From the ATC New Hiring Discord

8/9 Enroute

Class finished 3/11
ZLA
ZLC
ZFW/ZHU

From the ATC New Hiring Discord

Hope said:

8/9 Enroute

Class finished 3/11
ZLA
ZLC
ZFW/ZHU

From the ATC New Hiring Discord

That’s wild

Hope said:

8/9 Enroute

Class finished 3/11
ZLA
ZLC
ZFW/ZHU

From the ATC New Hiring Discord

FAA initial screening working well. Wow

Rx said:

That’s wild

Don’t worry the staffing issues will be solved in no time

Motodog said:

FAA initial screening working well. Wow

Maybe. We don't really know if the ones that made it are any good.

So 3 made it out. Probably can bet on 1 making it, maybe 2 max historically. It seems like only 50% are making it through the academy, not including who is washing out in basics. The FAA has royally screwed hiring. There is no way they can see numbers like this and not know it was better before (CTI days). My class had 16/18 pass and the two that failed went to Miami Dade and barely spoke English.

Hallock36 said:

So 3 made it out. Probably can bet on 1 making it, maybe 2 max historically. It seems like only 50% are making it through the academy, not including who is washing out in basics. The FAA has royally screwed hiring. There is no way they can see numbers like this and not know it was better before (CTI days). My class had 16/18 pass and the two that failed went to Miami Dade and barely spoke English.

I've been keeping track of the pass rates on evals for the past year and a half: Enroute Finals pass rate

But I was told that the pass rate at academy hovered around 60%

Hope said:

I've been keeping track of the pass rates on evals for the past year and a half: Enroute Finals pass rate

But I was told that the pass rate at academy hovered around 60%

Thank you for providing actual data. 67% or about 2/3 passing.

Hallock36 said:

So 3 made it out. Probably can bet on 1 making it, maybe 2 max historically. It seems like only 50% are making it through the academy, not including who is washing out in basics. The FAA has royally screwed hiring. There is no way they can see numbers like this and not know it was better before (CTI days). My class had 16/18 pass and the two that failed went to Miami Dade and barely spoke English.

Do you have any data to prove that success rates at the Academy were any better pre-2014? I'm CTI too, graduated December 2013 (fuck me, right?), and the 67% success rate that Hope references above is damn near within the margin of error for the pass rate that I remember hearing about while I was in school. Like anything, I would love to see data proving me wrong.

The biggest problem IMO is that the pre-employment process is complete garbage. The FAA has put years of research and millions of dollars into developing the ATSA and yet it’s virtually useless in determining who does/doesn’t have the basic skills to be successful. Because of that, the Academy is used more like a weeding out process as opposed to what it really should be: the first phase of training. Sure you learn some of the basic book knowledge and phraseology, but the focus is on having people play the Academy game instead of really teaching people how to work traffic.

And even as a weeding out process, OKC is failing because of how many people are washing out at facilities. The entire process is beyond flawed.

bomber996 said:

Thank you for providing actual data. 67% or about 2/3 passing.

Do you have any data to prove that success rates at the Academy were any better pre-2014? I'm CTI too, graduated December 2013 (fuck me, right?), and the 67% success rate that Hope references above is damn near within the margin of error for the pass rate that I remember hearing about while I was in school. Like anything, I would love to see data proving me wrong.

https://corescholar.libraries.wright.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1007&context=isap_2017

According to this study Enroute attrition rate was 2% from 2005-2010.

I remember when you heard people from a class didn’t make it, it was a huge deal. Like I said my class was basically 16/16. Two people who didn’t speak much English didn’t make it or really have a chance.

I find this studies 2% attrition rate shocking. Honestly I thought when I found the info that it would be like 10-20%. But this was back in the day, when there was no per diem and you made like 15K salary. So maybe it took a different kind of animal back then. Maybe it was it was when the kinder gentler FAA started too, so it was easier? Don’t know but the attrition rate in the field wasn’t much different, so it’s not like we were pushed through without merit. Hiring is fucked but I’ll be out in 7 years and it will be someone else’s problem.

Hallock36 said:

https://corescholar.libraries.wright.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1007&context=isap_2017

According to this study Enroute attrition rate was 2% from 2005-2010.

I remember when you heard people from a class didn’t make it, it was a huge deal. Like I said my class was basically 16/16. Two people who didn’t speak much English didn’t make it or really have a chance.

Straight from that document...

". In the period
2005 to 2010, FAA reverted to a one-stage selection process based on a computerized aptitude
test battery and training at the FAA Academy was conducted on a “pass/pass” basis."

Page 543

There's your 2% attrition rate. Pass/pass. This document also states that the field saw a subsequent higher washout rate in the field. I wonder why...

Interesting. If it was pass/pass then that’s news to me and the two people who failed out of my class.

But the document states “Elimination of screening did not result in an increase in the EnRoute attrition rate in 2005-10..”. Historically average was 26% and from 05-10 it was 28%.

P.S. stop making me read this whole document, i just wanted to look at a fancy graph.

Hallock36 said:

Interesting. If it was pass/pass then that’s news to me and the two people who failed out of my class.

But the document states “Elimination of screening did not result in an increase in the EnRoute attrition rate in 2005-10..”. Historically average was 26% and from 05-10 it was 28%.

P.S. stop making me read this whole document, i just wanted to look at a fancy graph.

LOL! I get it. I don't like to read either, unless I'm looking for something. I think we can all agree we all do this with the .65 from time to time.

Fair, the document did say the pass/pass didn't result in an increase in EnRoute attrition, but it did say that there was an increase in the Terminal attrition. Honestly I was surprised to find the pass/pass stat, but then again I was also very surprised by the 2% stat. Something doesn't add up here to me.

So not only are we already low staffed, the hiring process to add staffing takes forever, the actual people through training can hardly pass either… why the fuck is it so hard for us to get a pay raise??? We should be making that españa controller money fuck all this.

ClearanceClarence said:

The biggest problem IMO is that the pre-employment process is complete garbage. The FAA has put years of research and millions of dollars into developing the ATSA and yet it’s virtually useless in determining who does/doesn’t have the basic skills to be successful. ...

To be fair, we aren't seeing the people that did not make it through the ATSA screen. So the 50/50 on the other side might look very different without that screening method.

67% is too high. should be more like 33% and stop wasting the facilities time washing out dummies.