To be fair, I think it's pretty hard to fail the ATSA. I think the reason most who take it don't get hired is because they don't score best qualified but I would think if someone goes to CTI school and passes the ATSA even with the minimally qualified score, they'll be hired.It will also be interesting to see how they handle the ATSA hurdle. The FAA should, but likely won't, stipulate that the ATSA (or whatever its future equivalent might be) should be administered as an entrance exam for the CTI school. I can see a future where Johnny ATC Jr breezes through CTI school racking up years of loans only to get sucker-punched out of the selection process at the end by failing the ATSA.
Will also be interesting to see if "dream" facilities will get to essentially direct hire CTI grads and keep screwing NCEPT people over even more.
Oh god, I think I blocked that out my mind. Gotta give a quick scan of the entire EDST before a release.It taught me if there’s a single aircraft in the EDST at 4000 in another state, you sure as hell better not give a departure clearance to 4000 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yeah I'm in the same boat lol. But it is true cti didn't produce the diversity required and that was a major factor to then end the program.Honestly the CTI school I went to in 2007 told myself and my parents that we were automatically hired after graduating. Fucking scam artist, I got hired off the street after putting myself 20k in debt. Fuck them.
There was that, but the kicker was that CTI schools didn't produce better quality candidates either. So you had a diversity "barrier" that couldn't justify its existence.Yeah I'm in the same boat lol. But it is true cti didn't produce the diversity required and that was a major factor to then end the program.
Maybe embry can finally charge a million if there's a government subsidized tech training lmaoThere was that, but the kicker was that CTI schools didn't produce better quality candidates either. So you had a diversity "barrier" that couldn't justify its existence.
They need to figure out a way to make the program meaningful. But that goes against the "I'll take anybody's money if they just giving it away" ethos of colleges.
They already did a big study. Some programs produced better candidates. There was core schools that had real labs. Then the FAA started letting shitty online get your cti degree in 4 months crap to be allowedThere was that, but the kicker was that CTI schools didn't produce better quality candidates either. So you had a diversity "barrier" that couldn't justify its existence.
They need to figure out a way to make the program meaningful. But that goes against the "I'll take anybody's money if they just giving it away" ethos of colleges.
Hey brotha. I’m one of those. Not online but a 2 year community college degree that didn’t teach much. We all can’t afford a fancy school. But I was top of my class then, in OKC, and now certified at two high level facilities. No matter how you put it, you’re either fit for the job or you’re not.They already did a big study. Some programs produced better candidates. There was core schools that had real labs. Then the FAA started letting shitty online get your cti degree in 4 months crap to be allowed
And yet you still can’t just have an actual conversation about the issue. I went to a top CTI school in Canada and got very good gradesHey brotha. I’m one of those. Not online but a 2 year community college degree that didn’t teach much. We all can’t afford a fancy school. But I was top of my class then, in OKC, and now certified at two high level facilities. No matter how you put it, you’re either fit for the job or you’re not.
I don’t know where they got that number. Just monitoring this board it’s seems to be closer to 40-50% wash in OKCThis just aired. We really have 30% quit?
We already can go straight from college to ojti?
Oh yeah theybsaid 30%failI don’t know where they got that number. Just monitoring this board it’s seems to be closer to 40-50% wash in OKC
Why is our lord and savior Rich Santa failing to appear on these news segments to defend the CRWG spreadsheet that’s been validated by MITRE? Why is Santa not appearing on every ATC segment, good or bad, and stating the CRWG numbers are corrected staffing numbers and must be included in FAA ReAuth so we can staff ATC buildings appropriately and reduce fatigue from 24 hour schedules? It seems like an easy win for NATCA if they bring this to light in spite of the FAA’s narrative on national TV that they are trying everything and doing all they can to increase hiring and training. Hiring to the old numbers is not appropriate for air traffic anymore. It would make the dollars spent on the CRWG spreadsheet go a little further if NATCA could/would defend the staffing numbers on national TV and show the public that the FAA is refusing to adopt corrected staffing numbers and hire appropriately. They aren’t even running the academy at full capacity because of finance. So far the spreadsheet is not enough. It needs backup.This just aired. We really have 30% quit?
We already can go straight from college to ojti?
Pretty sure it said faa says needs and Union says double thatWhy is our lord and savior Rich Santa failing to appear on these news segments to defend the CRWG spreadsheet that’s been validated by MITRE? Why is Santa not appearing on every ATC segment, good or bad, and stating the CRWG numbers are corrected staffing numbers and must be included in FAA ReAuth so we can staff ATC buildings appropriately and reduce fatigue from 24 hour schedules? It seems like an easy win for NATCA if they bring this to light in spite of the FAA’s narrative on national TV that they are trying everything and doing all they can to increase hiring and training. Hiring to the old numbers is not appropriate for air traffic anymore. It would make the dollars spent on the CRWG spreadsheet go a little further if NATCA could/would defend the staffing numbers on national TV and show the public that the FAA is refusing to adopt corrected staffing numbers and hire appropriately. They aren’t even running the academy at full capacity because of finance. So far the spreadsheet is not enough. It needs backup.
The reporter stated that. But NATCA is letting a reporter give a 10 word blurb about what they say staffing should be rather than defend a spreadsheet they spent time and money on creating to help fix staffing, only to have it do absolutely nothing.Pretty sure it said faa says needs and Union says double that
I still don’t know how anyone would know that the old numbers are right or wrong.Why is our lord and savior Rich Santa failing to appear on these news segments to defend the CRWG spreadsheet that’s been validated by MITRE? Why is Santa not appearing on every ATC segment, good or bad, and stating the CRWG numbers are corrected staffing numbers and must be included in FAA ReAuth so we can staff ATC buildings appropriately and reduce fatigue from 24 hour schedules? It seems like an easy win for NATCA if they bring this to light in spite of the FAA’s narrative on national TV that they are trying everything and doing all they can to increase hiring and training. Hiring to the old numbers is not appropriate for air traffic anymore. It would make the dollars spent on the CRWG spreadsheet go a little further if NATCA could/would defend the staffing numbers on national TV and show the public that the FAA is refusing to adopt corrected staffing numbers and hire appropriately. They aren’t even running the academy at full capacity because of finance. So far the spreadsheet is not enough. It needs backup.
How much of the public cares about atc staffing...? Zero until their flights are delayed.The reporter stated that. But NATCA is letting a reporter give a 10 word blurb about what they say staffing should be rather than defend a spreadsheet they spent time and money on creating to help fix staffing, only to have it do absolutely nothing.
I work at a little OT available area. If we hit our new CRWG number I don’t know how we’d work more than 2 hours a day. It would be comical to say the leastHow much of the public cares about atc staffing...? Zero until their flights are delayed.
Congress may be a different story and into spreadsheets but the news doesn't care about that.
If you want to get the public's attention we need a scary story about 6 day work weeks and fatigue caused by staffing. Or about delays due to staffing.
Even then it won't help the faa can just say we have a brand new cti program.
Quote me in 5 years this forum will flip from we're understaffed to there's no ot available.
Also we are gonna hit by white book 2.0 if we keep pitching about staffing while facilities average under 5 on position.
NATCA used your dues to pay MITRE to verify and validate the CRWG numbers. It doesn’t matter if the numbers are right or wrong. This is the avenue they chose to go down. They have claimed it is a “repeatable process” but they won’t defend this process or the numbers when news segments like this come up and they have the opportunity to inform the public of the FAA’s mismanagement. They just let some reporter make a statement that says we need 2x what the FAA says we need with no data or evidence to back it up.I still don’t know how anyone would know that the old numbers are right or wrong.
Wasn’t the NYT article “the scary story about 6 day work weeks, fatigue and staffing shortages”. It dove deep into the staffing crisis and over working of controllers. If NATCA was on the news saying “we have a staffing problem, we’ve offered solutions, here they are, but the FAA is not going with the solutions for safety and instead going with financial solutions” I think we could get a few eyebrows raised when it comes to the safety air travel.How much of the public cares about atc staffing...? Zero until their flights are delayed.
Congress may be a different story and into spreadsheets but the news doesn't care about that.
If you want to get the public's attention we need a scary story about 6 day work weeks and fatigue caused by staffing. Or about delays due to staffing.
Even then it won't help the faa can just say we have a brand new cti program.
Quote me in 5 years this forum will flip from we're understaffed to there's no ot available.
Also we are gonna hit by white book 2.0 if we keep pitching about staffing while facilities average under 5 on position.
Yeah that's what I mean I think this is just a fluff piece following that.Wasn’t the NYT article “the scary story about 6 day work weeks, fatigue and staffing shortages”. It dove deep into the staffing crisis and over working of controllers. If NATCA was on the news saying “we have a staffing problem, we’ve offered solutions, here they are, but the FAA is not going with the solutions for safety and instead going with financial solutions” I think we could get a few eyebrows raised when it comes to the safety air travel.
Fluff piece or not, NATCA has been silent. They are noticeably absent from these segments and NOT advocating for their members. Especially on things they’ve spent significant time and dues money on creating, like the CRWG spreadsheet. The FAA managed to get somebody to appear to talk about their efforts. Where is NATCA? Were they not invited or uninterested? They have a whole team dedicated to PA like this but they’re probably working from home, unchecked, hitting the gym in the morning and mowing the lawn by noon with an ice cold beer in their hand cause they’re definitely not putting together easily digestible information and data about how poor staffing is and how overworked controllers are for the public to see on news segments such as these. In order to change the public’s perception of ATC they’d actually have to try.Yeah that's what I mean I think this is just a fluff piece following that.
That said I wouldn't be against using the same numbers and then slamming the goal of 1500 (or whatever it actually was in the video)
