Kim's Place OKC

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Jdmitchell92

Member
Messages
9
Any veterans in this thread know anything about preference between en route or terminal? I did some researching around and figured the general consensus is terminal is easier at academy to pass but generally lower pay and potential to get stuck in BFE vs. enroute you're likely to be near a big city with higher pay and busier airspace. Any other knowledge or things to know?
 

flypilot

Active Member
Messages
96
Any veterans in this thread know anything about preference between en route or terminal? I did some researching around and figured the general consensus is terminal is easier at academy to pass but generally lower pay and potential to get stuck in BFE vs. enroute you're likely to be near a big city with higher pay and busier airspace. Any other knowledge or things to know?
Enroute has higher pay because the lowest center is a 10 whereas the highest terminal facility terminal grads can go to is a 7. So by default there's automatically at least a 3 level pay difference. It's possible for an enroute grad to go to ZDC (a 12) and a terminal grad to go to APC (a 4) and have an 8 level pay difference.

Terminal is generally easier and has a better passrate than enroute, but the terminal facilities are generally in less than ideal areas. Most centers are in the suburbs of the city they're named after.

The preference is really up to you. Do you want to be in a dark room looking at a radar and working airplanes up at high altitude potentially hundreds of miles away? Or do you want to be working in a tower and be able to look outside? There is a 3rd option called the up/down which is a combined tower and approach control where part of the day you'll be in the tower and the other part in the radar room, but this position works airplanes nearby.

The reality is it doesn't matter because the FAA randomly assigns you terminal or enroute anyway. I was hoping for enroute and got terminal but I'm happy to just have a shot. The nice thing about terminal facilities is they generally have a shorter certification time so you can certify at a terminal facility sooner and move to a center or a big tower/ tracon soonish.
 

Ara

Trusted Contributor
Messages
210
The reality is it doesn't matter because the FAA randomly assigns you terminal or enroute anyway. I was hoping for enroute and got terminal but I'm happy to just have a shot.
That always seemed weird to me, because I got Enroute and wanted Terminal. I was told I couldn't change tracks, yet today dozens of people get Terminal classes. It never made sense to me why they couldn't ask if we had a preference
 

Jdmitchell92

Member
Messages
9
The preference is really up to you. Do you want to be in a dark room looking at a radar and working airplanes up at high altitude potentially hundreds of miles away? Or do you want to be working in a tower and be able to look outside? There is a 3rd option called the up/down which is a combined tower and approach control where part of the day you'll be in the tower and the other part in the radar room, but this position works airplanes nearby.
I guess I wouldn't know really. I got Terminal, and as someone coming from basically no aviation background maybe thats for the best?

Biggest factor would be location, as I imagine it is for a lot of people. Money not as much, I've never been anywhere where I made more than 18/hour, lol. I guess I wish I could ask some grads where they would have preferred if they took the money factor out of the equation. What gives you better hands on experience, what is easier to transition into straight out of academy, etc.
 

Mr. Miner

Trusted Contributor
Messages
149
Check out time (pre-COVID) is shorter in Terminal.

You could easily get checked out in under a year in Terminal.

Probably 2+ enroute.
 

flypilot

Active Member
Messages
96
But half way through enroute = CPC pay for terminal. The advantage is the terminal kid can start transferring
Yep. At a center the training pay surpasses terminal pay. The first pay raise at a 12 is basically the same as a level 5 CPC lol (assuming locality is equal)
 

BigEggplant

Trusted Contributor
Messages
164
I guess I wouldn't know really. I got Terminal, and as someone coming from basically no aviation background maybe thats for the best?

Biggest factor would be location, as I imagine it is for a lot of people. Money not as much, I've never been anywhere where I made more than 18/hour, lol. I guess I wish I could ask some grads where they would have preferred if they took the money factor out of the equation. What gives you better hands on experience, what is easier to transition into straight out of academy, etc.
Also no experience, went to an 8 tower to start (back when that was a thing), transferred to a 12 tower 4 years in, and at my second 12 tower now.

Part of it is luck, part competence (getting checked out and being good at the job) and part is persistence. I hear from people all the time that it’s not worth visiting facilities because of NCEPT. Maybe. But if there’s one place you want to be, and the manager has seen you every other month for the past year, they will likely be more inclined to put you high on the lost versus 40 other names when your NCEPT lottery comes up.

Also keep in mind that not all centers are in/near big cities, many are in the suburbs which I guess is fine. And if you wash out at a center, you’ll be 3 years into your career starting out again at a level 5 tower. Personally having come from no experience, I found the tower route to be a good intro, YMMV, and congrats on getting hired!
 

Foppery&Whim

Active Member
Messages
52
I'm considering bringing my car to the academy next year. Based on the registration requirements for OK non-residents, it seems we have to up to 30 days from the date of employment. Anyone know if we trainees are exempt from this requirement or would it be too much of a hassle to bring a car?
 

KiltedPiper

Member
Messages
18
I'm considering bringing my car to the academy next year. Based on the registration requirements for OK non-residents, it seems we have to up to 30 days from the date of employment. Anyone know if we trainees are exempt from this requirement or would it be too much of a hassle to bring a car?
i think since we are just there temporarily for training we are off the hook.
 

Aunah

Member
Messages
21
I'm considering bringing my car to the academy next year. Based on the registration requirements for OK non-residents, it seems we have to up to 30 days from the date of employment. Anyone know if we trainees are exempt from this requirement or would it be too much of a hassle to bring a car?
Its 30 days after establishing residency (12 months of living in OK)

Bringing car is good but not requirement. Can go places on weekend. But you could get by and make a friend to carpool with or use the shuttle if you stay at a place on the route.
 

BigEggplant

Trusted Contributor
Messages
164
I'm considering bringing my car to the academy next year. Based on the registration requirements for OK non-residents, it seems we have to up to 30 days from the date of employment. Anyone know if we trainees are exempt from this requirement or would it be too much of a hassle to bring a car?
Yeah you don’t have to register your car, since you’re only in the state temporarily.

Every time I‘ve moved for the FAA I kept my registration in the state where I came from until the month the tags were gonna expire, per the letter and spirit of the law you should absolutely register (not including the academy) but for
practical purposes you aren’t even sure you’ll stay somewhere new until you’re rated.
 

Cloud

Active Member
Messages
96
Yeah you don’t have to register your car, since you’re only in the state temporarily.

Every time I‘ve moved for the FAA I kept my registration in the state where I came from until the month the tags were gonna expire, per the letter and spirit of the law you should absolutely register (not including the academy) but for
practical purposes you aren’t even sure you’ll stay somewhere new until you’re rated.
Per the letter and spirit of the law you should absolutely, 100% not under any circumstances register in oklahoma unless you sign a lease for housing (not temporary for the academy) and intend to reside there "permanently"

Academy students know damn well they're leaving soon and boarding houses are not permanent places of residence.

One could (but never will) argue that registering your car in oklahoma is a tax avoidance scam as the plates are certainly cheaper there then California, or some other place where people actually want to live.

Do you register your car in tennessee when you go see gram gram for two weeks?

Also in pretty sure you technically work in Washington DC while at the academy, could be wrong about that one.

Also if you wait until your tabs expire in the new state you're technically breaking the law but the cop using the ticket would have to be very unhappy with you for something else. I have seen parking enforcement (miserable sacks) get people on this one if they have a bunch of parking tickets too.


Hope that helps clear things up for foppery.

I said what the eggplant said but I said it more good like
 
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Termine

Trusted Contributor
Messages
344
Also in pretty sure you technically work in Washington DC while at the academy, could be wrong about that one.
This is absolutely correct, your duty station is DC and therefore you get DC locality pay (I heard that was actually the reason for it, because they know academy basic pay is so shit). You're just on TDY to the Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center.

It makes for an interesting time the following April, because you were never actually a DC resident and therefore you don't owe the DC taxes they took out, you actually owe them to the state you lived in before going to the academy. You have to submit a form to DC to get those taxes back.
 

Cloud

Active Member
Messages
96
This is absolutely correct, your duty station is DC and therefore you get DC locality pay (I heard that was actually the reason for it, because they know academy basic pay is so shit). You're just on TDY to the Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center.

It makes for an interesting time the following April, because you were never actually a DC resident and therefore you don't owe the DC taxes they took out, you actually owe them to the state you lived in before going to the academy. You have to submit a form to DC to get those taxes back.
Fuck I left Washington state too soon. I don't wanna give Indiana more tax pesos
 
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