Hiring Bid FAA-ATO-22-ATCEXP-80642

SharDiNae

Member
Messages
42
Not necessarily. It was moreso based off his actual facility experience. I've seen plenty people with 10 years experience get absolute hot garbage lists. Pretty much should anticipate 7 and below unless you have radar experience. Even then, it's not guaranteed.
Yea makes sense.
 

RomeoTangoRT

Trusted Contributor
Messages
177
Does anyone get nice high level facilities anymore? Last one I saw was @pushingtin but it looks like they deleted their account
Here’s the SOP stating how facility levels/types are offered. You have to fit the perfect resume in there pretty much to get the 7, 8, 9 facilities. A bunch of experience has highly complex, intersecting runways, high traffic volume towers should certainly put you in the “high score relative to the pool” category. I have about 7 years worth of CTO experience on 4 towers plus radar final and approach. Will be interested to see how I stack up. If I still get offered 5, 6, 7 I’ll probably seek out another top contract tower to fill my 5th tower slot and if that doesn’t work, I’ll just accept my fate lol
 

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SharDiNae

Member
Messages
42
Here’s the SOP stating how facility levels/types are offered. You have to fit the perfect resume in there pretty much to get the 7, 8, 9 facilities. A bunch of experience has highly complex, intersecting runways, high traffic volume towers should certainly put you in the “high score relative to the pool” category. I have about 7 years worth of CTO experience on 4 towers plus radar final and approach. Will be interested to see how I stack up. If I still get offered 5, 6, 7 I’ll probably seek out another top contract tower to fill my 5th tower slot and if that doesn’t work, I’ll just accept my fate lol
thanks, def gonna be low score lol
 

ajmezz

Forum Sage
Messages
644
Here’s the SOP stating how facility levels/types are offered. You have to fit the perfect resume in there pretty much to get the 7, 8, 9 facilities. A bunch of experience has highly complex, intersecting runways, high traffic volume towers should certainly put you in the “high score relative to the pool” category. I have about 7 years worth of CTO experience on 4 towers plus radar final and approach. Will be interested to see how I stack up. If I still get offered 5, 6, 7 I’ll probably seek out another top contract tower to fill my 5th tower slot and if that doesn’t work, I’ll just accept my fate lol
IWA is always hiring. I'm sure that operation would bump it up significantly.
 

After_Victor

Trusted Contributor
Messages
287
Does anyone get nice high level facilities anymore? Last one I saw was @pushingtin but it looks like they deleted their account
I was offered 9’s on my list in May of this year. 5 CTOs and 1 approach ticket. I was given MYF lvl 9 tower only.
 

RomeoTangoRT

Trusted Contributor
Messages
177
IWA is always hiring. I'm sure that operation would bump it up significantly.
I have a cto from HWO from 2019. Idk how it’s played out in the years since and with Covid but we beat out IWA by about 50-75k ops that year and were in the top 30 nationally in traffic volume. I believe we did close to 400k that year if memory serves me correctly. I’d definitely be interested in adding IWA to the resume though. Big fan of Phoenix.

Actually.. we were either 27 or 32 in terms of traffic volume nationally. I can’t remember which.

0700-2100
6 controllers
Working 6-10s
Local combined up because we didn’t have staffing to open LC2
Making as much working 60 hours as FLL was making next door on 40 hours all while doing the same traffic as them with a 24hr tower. Certainly more difficult as we were dealing with 20-40 in the pattern at any given time while they had their airline sequence set 50 miles out. Definitely not salty about it 😂
 

ajmezz

Forum Sage
Messages
644
I have a cto from HWO from 2019. Idk how it’s played out in the years since and with Covid but we beat out IWA by about 50-75k ops that year and were in the top 30 nationally in traffic volume. I believe we did close to 400k that year if memory serves me correctly. I’d definitely be interested in adding IWA to the resume though. Big fan of Phoenix.
I just looked bc I was curious, but your numbers are way off. HWO barely broke 300k ops that year and only 15Kish more than IWA. FLL had almost 50k ops more than HWO that year. Not to downplay how hard you had to work and I fully understand how canned a place like FLL is. Bottom line is the FAA couldn't give less of a shit about single props beating up the pattern all day/night. IFR traffic runs their ranking systems and going to a place like IWA where you're mixing all of that together could give you that edge to get a better list. Then again its HR and I think we all know how inept HR can be in any industry.
 

RomeoTangoRT

Trusted Contributor
Messages
177
I just looked bc I was curious, but your numbers are way off. HWO barely broke 300k ops that year and only 15Kish more than IWA. FLL had almost 50k ops more than HWO that year. Not to downplay how hard you had to work and I fully understand how canned a place like FLL is. Bottom line is the FAA couldn't give less of a shit about single props beating up the pattern all day/night. IFR traffic runs their ranking systems and going to a place like IWA where you're mixing all of that together could give you that edge to get a better list. Then again its HR and I think we all know how inept HR can be in any industry.
Thanks for correcting me, bullshit aside lol I don’t have the numbers in front of me and was pulling them from memory, from like 3 years ago. I wholeheartedly agree and it’s why I would like to add IWA to my resume with regards to the mixed traffic. But so a different but relevant question for you - how DOES the FAA categorize/rank traffic? For example, APA is an 8, MCO is a 9, and SLC is a 10 but they all do within 10-20k ops of each other (or did on the list I was looking at from 2018. Just curious if it’s arbitrary or there’s an actual formula to determine it.
 

ajmezz

Forum Sage
Messages
644
Thanks for correcting me, bullshit aside lol I don’t have the numbers in front of me and was pulling them from memory, from like 3 years ago. I wholeheartedly agree and it’s why I would like to add IWA to my resume with regards to the mixed traffic. But so a different but relevant question for you - how DOES the FAA categorize/rank traffic? For example, APA is an 8, MCO is a 9, and SLC is a 10 but they all do within 10-20k ops of each other (or did on the list I was looking at from 2018. Just curious if it’s arbitrary or there’s an actual formula to determine it.
If you can find a copy of the slate book laying around, there's a formula in it that the faa uses to determine facility level. Basically they take into account rwy config, airspace complexity, type of traffic, etc and all of that gives you points that a wizard then shits out what they deem appropriate. IFR traffic is king though. Also there is a program you can look at called the TCIP (traffic count index program) from an faa computer at aap.faa.gov. Gives all kinds of information, trends, upgrades/downgrades, etc. Kind of interesting once you figure it out.
 

RomeoTangoRT

Trusted Contributor
Messages
177
If you can find a copy of the slate book laying around, there's a formula in it that the faa uses to determine facility level. Basically they take into account rwy config, airspace complexity, type of traffic, etc and all of that gives you points that a wizard then shits out what they deem appropriate. IFR traffic is king though. Also there is a program you can look at called the TCIP (traffic count index program) from an faa computer at aap.faa.gov. Gives all kinds of information, trends, upgrades/downgrades, etc. Kind of interesting once you figure it out.
I’ve messed around with the TCIP before a little bit. A lot of different stuff you can play with, quite interesting. We definitely didn’t do a bunch of IFR traffic and when we did, we got dicked over by Miami pretty much every time. Hour+ departure delays because who gives a shit about an IFR single prop when they’re running ACs all over soflo airspace.

Sheesh though… IWA offering $36.03/hr should be illegal. That’s robbery. Not sure if they’re unionized but Serco is heavily anti-union from my experience with them. Almost a $5/hr pay decrease going out there. “Additional complexity allowance provided.” Hmm.. wonder what that entails. Definitely gonna keep it on my radar for after I sell my house.
 

Cmsgthokage

Trusted Contributor
Messages
639
Anyone wondering what tower and levels you’re going to get on your list just ask your homies who recently got picked up about their lists. Just expect tower only if you’ve only had a CTO or up/downs if you had an approach ticket. Unless your base was “busy” don’t expect anything higher than a 7.
 

RB

Active Member
Messages
85
I’ve messed around with the TCIP before a little bit. A lot of different stuff you can play with, quite interesting. We definitely didn’t do a bunch of IFR traffic and when we did, we got dicked over by Miami pretty much every time. Hour+ departure delays because who gives a shit about an IFR single prop when they’re running ACs all over soflo airspace.

Sheesh though… IWA offering $36.03/hr should be illegal. That’s robbery. Not sure if they’re unionized but Serco is heavily anti-union from my experience with them. Almost a $5/hr pay decrease going out there. “Additional complexity allowance provided.” Hmm.. wonder what that entails. Definitely gonna keep it on my radar for after I sell my house.
I worked next door at CHD. We had I believe it was 25 cents an hour extra for the complexity pay.. I believe IWA is 50 cents. This was a little over a year ago anyways, maybe it changed.
 

RomeoTangoRT

Trusted Contributor
Messages
177
I worked next door at CHD. We had I believe it was 25 cents an hour extra for the complexity pay.. I believe IWA is 50 cents. This was a little over a year ago anyways, maybe it changed.
Why not just advertise $36.53 instead? Is the extra allowance provided by the company or the city? Where I’m at now, if I have to stay open late for American, the airport authority pays the OT instead of the company.
 

D-Dub

Trusted Contributor
Messages
194
This thread is more active than the bid I'm awaiting. Anyone know if it's possible to update experience by the time I go to receive a list? Since the bid closed, I've obtained a CTO at a significantly busier and more complex location than any of the ones I was previously at. Been here about 7 months.
 

RomeoTangoRT

Trusted Contributor
Messages
177
This thread is more active than the bid I'm awaiting. Anyone know if it's possible to update experience by the time I go to receive a list? Since the bid closed, I've obtained a CTO at a significantly busier and more complex location than any of the ones I was previously at. Been here about 7 months.
It’s possible you could go back to the questionnaire link you were sent at the beginning of the process. Although, not sure how much weight it would hold being less than a year. I also personally believe adding any relevant experience is beneficial. Make them tell you it doesn’t count ya know? I did see someone earlier stated they re-did their questionnaire. I believe they reached out to their HR rep.
 

Bingbong2996

Member
Messages
11
This thread is more active than the bid I'm awaiting. Anyone know if it's possible to update experience by the time I go to receive a list? Since the bid closed, I've obtained a CTO at a significantly busier and more complex location than any of the ones I was previously at. Been here about 7 months.
I think they usually put out another experience bid at the beginning of the year so maybe do that one too and if you don’t like the list you get for this one then you’ve got the next bid.
 
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