Reinstatement

[DidYouDoYourNATPRO]

Technically, if you quit and are seeking reinstatement, you’re not an active dues paying member and not entitled to representation…

Is it not a form of harm to your current members by letting the agency flagrantly disregard agreed upon hiring practices which have a direct effect on their staffing, leave, and right to a safe work environment?

For fucks sake it's not that hard

 

[Nothanks]

Is it not a form of harm to your current members by letting the agency flagrantly disregard agreed upon hiring practices which have a direct effect on their staffing, leave, and right to a safe work environment?

For fucks sake it's not that hard

It’s not that hard, maybe the neb doesn’t even know. Anyone going to alert them to this ?

Not like they have a formal way to grieve this though since they aren’t covered

 

[Soul_Controller]

Is it not a form of harm to your current members by letting the agency flagrantly disregard agreed upon hiring practices which have a direct effect on their staffing, leave, and right to a safe work environment?

For fucks sake it's not that hard

So let's say you guys are right about the agency conspiring to fuck over reinstatements... Just what is the bargaining unit supposed to put up for negotiating to get this fixed? What horse trading is supposed to happen for the sake of a small group of people that aren't even in the union?

 

[Dolan]

So let's say you guys are right about the agency conspiring to fuck over reinstatements... Just what is the bargaining unit supposed to put up for negotiating to get this fixed? What horse trading is supposed to happen for the sake of a small group of people that aren't even in the union?

Nothing. The reinstatement policy as it stood pre resignation exodus was viewed by the FAA as beneficial to them as it allowed people with proven aptitude a shortcut back into the agency to fill empty seats.

The FAA has changed their stance on this (rightly so imo) and now realizes that quitting to get rehired somewhere that sucks less is too juicy of an incentive with now hard transferring is now and does more to hurt staffing than help it. So of course they decided that the policy that they engineered had to go/get altered.

NATCA had absolutely nothing to do with the previous reinstatement policy and they won't have anything to do with how it's administered going forward.

 

[Redacted]

Is it not a form of harm to your current members by letting the agency flagrantly disregard agreed upon hiring practices which have a direct effect on their staffing, leave, and right to a safe work environment?

For fucks sake it's not that hard

Other members could argue it’s a harm to them via circumnavigating NCEPT

 

[BDUB]

Kind of crazy they change the process without a warning and anyone in the middle of it is hung out to dry…also they will just hire these same individuals on a prior experience bid what’s the difference except the faa has to wait longer for them to reach facilities and help staffing?

 

[HammerHead]

Kind of crazy they change the process without a warning and anyone in the middle of it is hung out to dry…also they will just hire these same individuals on a prior experience bid what’s the difference except the faa has to wait longer for them to reach facilities and help staffing?

I wouldn't say without warning, I heard rumors 5-6 months before they dropped the SOP and was told directly by a regional VP that they were reworking the SOP 3 months before it dropped.

I was a resignation and hit my 12 months just before the SOP dropped. I knew before I resigned that there would be a lot of unknowns and figured it was too good to be true walking into any facility you want. Still worth it to climb out of the black hole though.

 

[mcubed820]

I've been working level 12 traffic for more than ten years and I'm honestly getting really tired of it. It's actually not even the traffic, it's the inability to get a day off. Completely burned out. I'd gladly take half pay for a country club at this point, but there's no way out. Hopelessness shouldn't be the overarching experience in your workforce

I mean.............we can swap if you REALLY want to lol

 

[ATC123]

OP have you written your Senator or Congressman? Seems like a logical start. My hunch is there might be more to the story, but if you truly can't get hired for no good reason, given the current staffing situation I think this would be a case that one of your elected representatives would happily take on.

 

[mcubed820]

If you rather quit than take on a busy/complex level 12 then it sounds more like a lack of ability/confidence than anything else. I’m a gen X guy, and I may be wired differently, but for me failure was never an option. Like I mentioned before, for me the career was more important than the location. I’ll admit I don’t understand too much today’s generations with a sense of entitlement that need everything handed in a platter.

Another Gen X/Boomer bashing on the younger generations...shocker. If I had a dollar every time I heard something along those lines I'd be making level 12 pay.
I don't totally disagree with you, some people in our generation are not cut out for the job and get pushed through for one reason or another. And I'm sure that happened back in your day, too. Let's not even begin to talk about how many deals/unsafe situations were swept under the rug back in your day. Like you, this is my dream job. I'm still very early in my career, but it will always be my dream job.

I think part of the problem is ex-controllers at the academy have such an outdated idea of the transfer process. They tell AGs they'll be able to move within a year or two of certifying and it doesn't happen. So when a CPC isn't out of their lower level up-down within 5 years, they start to panic and look for jobs they would've never thought of (sup, contract, etc.). I think it also happens with previous experience controllers - they come in thinking it'll be a quick jump and it's just not. And don't get me wrong, having to listen to people bitch about being stuck 24/7 is a lot to deal with at times when someone like myself waited years for this job. But it's important to see where they're coming from.
Don't knock someone for having to do what they have to do to be happy. Not everyone is ok being 2,000 miles away from their families. Not everyone is ok working 10-hr, 6 day work weeks. Not everyone is ok working level 12 traffic. Not everyone in today's generation expect things to be handed to us on a platter, but we sure as hell need to (and hopefully are going to) fight for what's right.

 

[DidYouDoYourNATPRO]

Nothing. The reinstatement policy as it stood pre resignation exodus was viewed by the FAA as beneficial to them as it allowed people with proven aptitude a shortcut back into the agency to fill empty seats.

The FAA has changed their stance on this (rightly so imo) and now realizes that quitting to get rehired somewhere that sucks less is too juicy of an incentive with now hard transferring is now and does more to hurt staffing than help it. So of course they decided that the policy that they engineered had to go/get altered.

NATCA had absolutely nothing to do with the previous reinstatement policy and they won't have anything to do with how it's administered going forward.

I'm fairly certain there's a NATCA signature on the new guidance

Other members could argue it’s a harm to them via circumnavigating NCEPT

Bold of you to assume everyone's motivations as nefarious

Other members could argue it’s a harm to them via circumnavigating NCEPT

You really think every single reinstatement request was to circumvent NCEPT? That's a pretty awful mindset. Have you thought about a headquarters position?

I mean.............we can swap if you REALLY want to lol

No... we can't


Swaps are below NCEPT priority

 

[Move78]

I'm fairly certain there's a NATCA signature on the new guidance

And fairly wrong.
The union does not hire.
The union does not place.

 

[Redacted]

Bold of you to assume everyone's motivations as nefarious

I don’t. I’m playing devils advocate, and while I don’t think resigning to get where you want is “nefarious”, if NATCA were to be representing people through this process it would become the unilaterally strongest method of transfer, which would undermine both the NCEPT process and potentially (and very likely) cripple several facilities if everyone at somewhere like ZOA knew all it took was one year off to get where they want to be.

 

[DidYouDoYourNATPRO]

And fairly wrong.
The union does not hire.
The union does not place.

NATCA reps were listed as an interviewee in the process when the new guidance was published. Either ATM or NATCA reps have the power to say no to reinstatement and the process ends. Only issue I'm having is finding the document.

Fwiw I didn't mean to send that response, it was typed earlier and I was still looking for the citation.

 

[Move78]

NATCA reps were listed as an interviewee in the process when the new guidance was published. Either ATM or NATCA reps have the power to say no to reinstatement and the process ends. Only issue I'm having is finding the document.

Fwiw I didn't mean to send that response, it was typed earlier and I was still looking for the citation.

You’re referring to a reference check.
The union does not hire or place.

 

[FightingIrish2012]

If natca is going to let HR horsefuckery impact hiring and not complain about it, they can stfu about cwrg numbers, 2nd academy and how understaffed we are. They aren’t talking about it because they are complicit in creating this situation where it’s better to quit than to rot for a decade at a level 6

This is the thing, even if they created a second academy the HR fuckery would still only get them a max of 1750 or so hires a year even if they then had the capacity for 2800. Plus the second academy would have to be in high COLA Chicago or NYC basically when you look at the parameters of where to build it in the proposed FAA Reauthorization with it. So good luck getting retired controllers to move there and work as contractors to staff a new academy.

 

[DidYouDoYourNATPRO]

You’re referring to a reference check.
The union does not hire or place.

Rejection of hiring is a hiring practice that directly harms the membership

 

[Mk2186]

Update if anyone still following. After my denied reinstatement my wife did tons of digging. Got a lawyer and talked with the senator. FAA said final offer - NO to me again.
A few months later out of the blue I got an email for reinstatement, did all the necessary items. My MMPI was inconclusive I had to retake it, but then everything went through and just received a list. Unfortunately, everything on the list is three hours from my home. I told my HR rep that I am established here and not leaving and did not want anything on the list provided she replied with OK what facilities are you interested in? I told her and she said she would get back to me.
Pretty interesting ……

 

[Mike Kilo]

Update if anyone still following. After my denied reinstatement my wife did tons of digging. Got a lawyer and talked with the senator. FAA said final offer - NO to me again.
A few months later out of the blue I got an email for reinstatement, did all the necessary items. My MMPI was inconclusive I had to retake it, but then everything went through and just received a list. Unfortunately, everything on the list is three hours from my home. I told my HR rep that I am established here and not leaving and did not want anything on the list provided she replied with OK what facilities are you interested in? I told her and she said she would get back to me.
Pretty interesting ……

I’ve been offered a facility in Australia and debating if it’s worth doing it for a few years and trying to get back. Your story scares me and I know the FAA likes to change things on a whim lol. Reinstatement might not be a thing by the time I can reapply!!

 

[GulfCharlie]

I’ve been offered a facility in Australia and debating if it’s worth doing it for a few years and trying to get back. Your story scares me and I know the FAA likes to change things on a whim lol. Reinstatement might not be a thing by the time I can reapply!!

Which one?