Shoot The Breeze

[ATCJoe85]

Rant follows:
SF is such a weird case study.
As mentioned above, large groups of people sharing a couple bedrooms? The semantics of being an adult with desires that demand at least some level of privacy just doesnt align. Then again, it is SF, so maybe nobody GAF about privacy in that regard.
I'm surprised the city hasn't collapsed. While I'm happy to field a "living wage" discussion, that possibility lapsed decades ago in SF. Should McDonalds pay its SF employees $60 an hour so they can live in healthy conditions without an unreasonable commute? Answer: No. But now that suggests that low-skilled jobs should disappear from SF, and then how do the ones who can actually afford it get their Fast-Food Fix, or even their groceries? Suddenly a lot fewer people will want to live there when they have to cross a toll bridge to purchase basic needs.
Less demand and more supply might balance the situation a bit.

Like, how do you argue that a company should pay you enough to survive in a place that everyone (oddly) wants to be in, instead of finding a place to live where the company pay makes it easy to survive.

Like, if Arkansas Mcdonalds pays $8/hr $1300/mo, and a one bedroom runs $700, doesn't that make more sense than $15/hr $2400/mo in SF and paying $700 to split a single bedroom 5 ways.

 

[Shikaka]

I'm from North Northern Cali...just saying long live the State of Jefferson!!!

 

[ONE]

Rant follows:
SF is such a weird case study.
As mentioned above, large groups of people sharing a couple bedrooms? The semantics of being an adult with desires that demand at least some level of privacy just doesnt align. Then again, it is SF, so maybe nobody GAF about privacy in that regard.
I'm surprised the city hasn't collapsed. While I'm happy to field a "living wage" discussion, that possibility lapsed decades ago in SF. Should McDonalds pay its SF employees $60 an hour so they can live in healthy conditions without an unreasonable commute? Answer: No. But now that suggests that low-skilled jobs should disappear from SF, and then how do the ones who can actually afford it get their Fast-Food Fix, or even their groceries? Suddenly a lot fewer people will want to live there when they have to cross a toll bridge to purchase basic needs.
Less demand and more supply might balance the situation a bit.

Like, how do you argue that a company should pay you enough to survive in a place that everyone (oddly) wants to be in, instead of finding a place to live where the company pay makes it easy to survive.

Like, if Arkansas Mcdonalds pays $8/hr $1300/mo, and a one bedroom runs $700, doesn't that make more sense than $15/hr $2400/mo in SF and paying $700 to split a single bedroom 5 ways.

I have some friends in SV that would laugh at any entry level job offer (college educated) that isn't $150K minimum in SF. If you're that highly skilled then they'll want you. If you're not clearing $100K minimum or you're rich outside your job, you shouldn't live in SF.

No one wants to live in Arkansas though. That's like saying any (insert Central US state here) is desirable to work at a McDonald's in just because real estate is dirt cheap there.


Rent is expensive because the tech industry chose to aggregate in in a city that has most buildings zoned as a historical building so you can't tear them down easily and build apartment complexes to fix the supply. If you were a real estate owner and knew that the average income in SF was close to $100K for a college grad, would you jack up your rent? Of course!

TL;DR Most cities are strained on either the demand or supply side, SF is squeezed on both high demand and little supply and it fucks the poor over and widens the inequality gap. Rent control doesn't work either.

Same thing is happening to Seattle but slower because there's actually a lot of real-estate around the area and it's feasible to have a car.

 

[Motodog]

I have some friends in SV that would laugh at any entry level job offer (college educated) that isn't $150K minimum in SF. If you're that highly skilled then they'll want you. If you're not clearing $100K minimum or you're rich outside your job, you shouldn't live in SF.

No one wants to live in Arkansas though. That's like saying any (insert Central US state here) is desirable to work at a McDonald's in just because real estate is dirt cheap there.


Rent is expensive because the tech industry chose to aggregate in in a city that has most buildings zoned as a historical building so you can't tear them down easily and build apartment complexes to fix the supply. If you were a real estate owner and knew that the average income in SF was close to $100K for a college grad, would you jack up your rent? Of course!

TL;DR Most cities are strained on either the demand or supply side, SF is squeezed on both high demand and little supply and it fucks the poor over and widens the inequality gap. Rent control doesn't work either.

Same thing is happening to Seattle but slower because there's actually a lot of real-estate around the area and it's feasible to have a car.

Close but no cigar. He thinks left coast cost of living is high because of ‘historical buildings’ and a ‘lot of real estate around.’ Could be because they’re welfare state areas, tax and spend train wrecks run for decades by liberals. Maybe...just maybe

 

[spider]

There is a whole big world between San Francisco and Arkansas. I wouldn't want to live in either.

But, I will say that California is a great place to visit but not live in. Arkansas is neither.

 

[Raise when?]

There is a whole big world between San Francisco and Arkansas. I wouldn't want to live in either.

But, I will say that California is a great place to visit but not live in. Arkansas is neither.

I'd love to live in socal if I had the scratch. Need to be able to afford 1mm+ mortgage in the area I'd like to live..

 

[Monroe]

There is a whole big world between San Francisco and Arkansas. I wouldn't want to live in either.

But, I will say that California is a great place to visit but not live in. Arkansas is neither.

I have hiked, fished, canoed, camped, and have ridden through Arkansas. I would say I had a good time, and it is a worth a visit (of course if those things are your cup of tea).

 

[twn]

There is a whole big world between San Francisco and Arkansas. I wouldn't want to live in either.

But, I will say that California is a great place to visit but not live in. Arkansas is neither.

You've obviously never been to Arkansas

 

[ONE]

Close but no cigar. He thinks left coast cost of living is high because of ‘historical buildings’ and a ‘lot of real estate around.’ Could be because they’re welfare state areas, tax and spend train wrecks run for decades by liberals. Maybe...just maybe

What's your source for "welfare state areas", "tax and spend train wrecks"?

San Francisco's Regulations Are The Cause Of Its Housing Crisis

And it's not just one regulation that made the city expensive. It's all of them.

marketurbanismreport.com

But hey, this source looks unprofessional- so let's look at Wikipedia: San Francisco housing shortage - Wikipedia
And here's a quote about what I talked about from the wikipedia page:
"For example, from 2012 to 2016, the San Francisco metropolitan area added 373,000 new jobs, but permitted only 58,000 new housing units."

Sounds like supply is too low, and demand is too high! But what do I know? Surely a guy with a master's in economics doesn't know about supply demand curves, the first thing you learn in an introductory economics class!

I wrote my master's thesis on the economics of SF housing. If SF could "Manhattanize" by just building a 50-floor apartment complexes across, they'd do it as fast as humanly possible. Housing prices would equalize. Blaming a poorly run city on "muh liberals" is like blaming the sun for global warming

Believe it or not, inefficient government happens under both conservatives and liberals lmao. If "being run by liberals" is such a problem then why isn't the entire state of California suffering from the same problems? There are cities in CA where it's actually nice to live, believe it or not. If your daily standard of living is affected by your state government, then it sounds like you have a money problem and can't move, not a government problem.

But hey, keep posting about waiting to get your FOL and complaining about the libs, hope you get sent to ZOA!

 

[PushingTin]

I wrote my master's thesis on the economics of SF housing.

ru a vegan too?

 

[ONE]

ru a vegan too?

Believe it or not, I went to one of the most conservative universities in the country.

You can be a poorly run city with a majority of liberals, and you can be a poorly run city with a majority of conservatives.
See: Oklahoma City and San Francisco

 

[PushingTin]

Believe it or not, I went to one of the most conservative universities in the country.

A christian school?

 

[Motodog]

What's your source for "welfare state areas", "tax and spend train wrecks"?

San Francisco's Regulations Are The Cause Of Its Housing Crisis

And it's not just one regulation that made the city expensive. It's all of them.

marketurbanismreport.com

But hey, this source looks unprofessional- so let's look at Wikipedia: San Francisco housing shortage - Wikipedia
And here's a quote about what I talked about from the wikipedia page:
"For example, from 2012 to 2016, the San Francisco metropolitan area added 373,000 new jobs, but permitted only 58,000 new housing units."

Sounds like supply is too low, and demand is too high! But what do I know?

I wrote my master's thesis on the economics of SF housing. If SF could "Manhattanize" by just building a 50-floor apartment complexes across, they'd do it as fast as humanly possible. Housing prices would equalize. Blaming a poorly run city on "muh liberals" is like blaming the sun for global warming

Believe it or not, inefficient government happens under both conservatives and liberals lmao. If "being run by liberals" is such a problem then why isn't the entire state of California suffering from the same problems? There are cities in CA where it's actually nice to live, believe it or not. If your daily standard of living is affected by your state government, then it sounds like you have a money problem and can't move, not a government problem.

But hey, keep posting about waiting to get your FOL and complaining about the libs, hope you get sent to ZOA!

Easy...easy...Sorry to cloud the issue w facts, I know libs hate that. ? Fairly easy to look at cities/states in near bankrupt state. Common denominator-run by Democrats.

 

[ONE]

Easy...easy...Sorry to cloud the issue w facts, I know libs hate that. ? Fairly easy to look at cities/states in near bankrupt state. Common denominator-run by Democrats.

Where's your source? If you don't have sources that are meaningful then the discussion is moot lol

I could say "Warren Buffett eats children" and have no sources for that- would I be clouding a discussion with facts?

A christian school?

Considering a majority of conservatives are christian, yes it could be considered a christian school. Never heard of a non-secular conservative university

 

[StealthChain]

I enjoyed most of California areas I lived in. Lived near Joshua Tree which is not great as a town, but a pretty area at least. Lived in Orange County and Carlsbad as well and loved it in both. Also lived in Menifee (Temecula area) which was nice with the lower housing costs and not a shitty clustered area like San Bernardino/Riverside area. The best part was being military so I only had to deal with the laws and certain politics of California while getting to pay 0% state tax for Florida.

 

[Shikaka]

I could say "Warren Buffett eats children" and have no sources for that- would I be clouding a discussion with facts?

I mean...I wouldn't doubt it...

 

[ONE]

I mean...I wouldn't doubt it...

But I have no source! Try researching claims people make and you'll be surprised as to what is true and what is not. Can't go off your gut instinct forever.

 

[Shikaka]

But I have no source! Try researching claims people make and you'll be surprised as to what is true and what is not. Can't go off your gut instinct forever.

Yet accepting sources as a requirement against logic in an argument is as equally as ridiculous. Don't get me wrong, a vetted source can make an argument more legitimate but that doesn't mean it has credibility. Plenty of reputable sources will swear opposites of each other all day, and yet the only thing we can do is utilize logic, or "gut feeling".

Cuomo is literallly begging the wealthy to return to NY because his tax policies drove them out, yet his voter base want to tax them more. Utopia is dope until it runs out of funding.

Meanwhile Appalachia is an example of extreme conservative, but I'm willing to say that one side had a larger amount of free choice along their destitute path.

Either way, each party ponders to their base with blatant disregard.

 

[Motodog]

What's your source for "welfare state areas", "tax and spend train wrecks"?

San Francisco's Regulations Are The Cause Of Its Housing Crisis

And it's not just one regulation that made the city expensive. It's all of them.

marketurbanismreport.com

But hey, this source looks unprofessional- so let's look at Wikipedia: San Francisco housing shortage - Wikipedia
And here's a quote about what I talked about from the wikipedia page:
"For example, from 2012 to 2016, the San Francisco metropolitan area added 373,000 new jobs, but permitted only 58,000 new housing units."

Sounds like supply is too low, and demand is too high! But what do I know?

I wrote my master's thesis on the economics of SF housing. If SF could "Manhattanize" by just building a 50-floor apartment complexes across, they'd do it as fast as humanly possible. Housing prices would equalize. Blaming a poorly run city on "muh liberals" is like blaming the sun for global warming

Believe it or not, inefficient government happens under both conservatives and liberals lmao. If "being run by liberals" is such a problem then why isn't the entire state of California suffering from the same problems? There are cities in CA where it's actually nice to live, believe it or not. If your daily standard of living is affected by your state government, then it sounds like you have a money problem and can't move, not a government problem.

But hey, keep posting about waiting to get your FOL and complaining about the libs, hope you get sent to ZOA!

If SFO could just build a 50 floor complex..?... but the environmentmental wackos would demand a 3 year impact study, they would be taxed into left wing utopian oblivian. But hey...IF a frog had wings he wouldn’t wear himself out hoppin’ now would he? But only if....

 

[PushingTin]

.Cuomo is literallly begging the wealthy to return to NY because his tax policies drove them out, yet his voter base want to tax them more.

He has had several surreal "not the onion" moments since Covid, but the video of him begging rich people to come back to his shithole might be an all timer. "I will cook you dinner, I will buy you a drink". Its so awkward and bizzare. I guess his "covid mountain" , killing the old people, and making a fool of himself on CNN w his brother are worse, but thats fucking bad.

Lol oh yeah and remember when he threatened to SUE Rhode island for barring NYers, and now he is doing it to like 32 states. If not a double standard then no standard at all.