Transportation Industry Pay Increases

[BDUB]

I feel like sacrificies aren’t talked about enough. Moving cross country. Working mids. Bad sleep schedule. First 10yrs don’t even think about weekends off good luck meeting people in a new city with tues. Wed. Off. Mandatory OT. 4hrs of leave when you start. Rarely get holidays off. All that for lvl 4, 5, 6 money is kinda crazy IMO

 

[SolicitSVFR]

I feel like sacrificies aren’t talked about enough. Moving cross country. Working mids. Bad sleep schedule. First 10yrs don’t even think about weekends off good luck meeting people in a new city with tues. Wed. Off. Mandatory OT. 4hrs of leave when you start. Rarely get holidays off. All that for lvl 4, 5, 6 money is kinda crazy IMO

And they lock you tf down from transferring. I’ve been seeing an uptick of low to mid level FAA getting scalped by the DoD a lot lately. Once people figure out there is no NCEPT into other federal agencies and you can leave in a matter of weeks, I think a lot of people will consider jumping ship

 

[Ad1234]

I think you’re also losing sight of the fact that it isn’t just truck drivers, pilots are another example. It’s the entire transportation industry except ATC. It doesn’t even have to be an increase in pay. Increase our match then. Do SOMETHING more than what is being done. Significantly more.

I agree something should be done. But comparing us to private industry is something that’s not gonna work. When USPS gets a raise, sure.

 

[AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise]

Pilots do almost nothing.

This is 100% false.

 

[Brotallion]

This is 100% false.

You are correct. It should have read airline pilots do almost nothing. They don’t plan their route. They don’t file flight plans. After takeoff, everything is automated. If something needs to be done they reach up and push a button or turn a dial. Can’t even be bothered to answer a radio call en-route, but heaven forbid you don’t tell them where the completely smooth rides are. My area worked sessions yesterday that if these airline unions saw, they’d advocate us to get matching raises for keeping planes safe and traffic flowing. NATCA didn’t even try to get us a dollar when we have the much more complex job. So frustrating.

 

[CoffeeIV]

Mandatory OT.

Where is this mandatory OT? I bang every overtime shift as do most of my coworkers. There is no penalty.

 

[AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise]

You are correct. It should have read airline pilots do almost nothing. They don’t plan their route. They don’t file flight plans. After takeoff, everything is automated. If something needs to be done they reach up and push a button or turn a dial. Can’t even be bothered to answer a radio call en-route, but heaven forbid you don’t tell them where the completely smooth rides are. My area worked sessions yesterday that if these airline unions saw, they’d advocate us to get matching raises for keeping planes safe and traffic flowing. NATCA didn’t even try to get us a dollar when we have the much more complex job. So frustrating.

I’d agree the slate book extension was a mistake, but to say pilots do nothing is just flat out ignorant. By that logic, all we do is click a button and type on a keyboard.

 

[SolicitSVFR]

Where is this mandatory OT? I bang every overtime shift as do most of my coworkers. There is no penalty.

Banging out on scheduled OT is no different then banging out on a normal shift. Every facility is different but you can be put on SL abuse

 

[Move78]

If you work for a private sector airline and your company is pulling a billion a quarter in profit then yeah you should get a piece. I hope their success helps us but we’re not the same. They also got billions in bailouts from the government to avoid getting laid off and literally the first minute that free money ran out they furloughed thousands of workers.

 

[Raise when?]

I agree something should be done. But comparing us to private industry is something that’s not gonna work. When USPS gets a raise, sure.

We’re highly skilled labor in the transportation industry. You’re veering wildly off topic to try and make a point against us

If you work for a private sector airline and your company is pulling a billion a quarter in profit then yeah you should get a piece. I hope their success helps us but we’re not the same. They also got billions in bailouts from the government to avoid getting laid off and literally the first minute that free money ran out they furloughed thousands of workers.

It’s true we’re not the same, but their profits hinge on our ability to let them do their job safely. They can’t move the planes they do without us.

 

[Ad1234]

We’re highly skilled labor in the transportation industry. You’re veering wildly off topic to try and make a point against us

I agree we are are highly skilled labor. And the ones who make it, should be handsomely rewarded. You have zero arguments with me there.

I don’t think I’m veering off topic, I’m saying focusing on a total compensation package far less than our job and in my opinion with far worse lifetime working conditions is stupid. Our job compared to theirs has the exact same entrance requirements and that’s how outsiders see it. We need to find a better argument than UPS.we will end up sounding like entitled brats.

 

[Raise when?]

I agree we are are highly skilled labor. And the ones who make it, should be handsomely rewarded. You have zero arguments with me there.

I don’t think I’m veering off topic, I’m saying focusing on a total compensation package far less than our job and in my opinion with far worse lifetime working conditions is stupid. Our job compared to theirs has the exact same entrance requirements and that’s how outsiders see it. We need to find a better argument than UPS.we will end up sounding like entitled brats.

I’ve seen you in a few of these threads, each time bickering incessantly against the wants of controllers. Honestly I’m curious how much time you’ve spent trying to formulate shitty arguments on how overpaid we are lmao.

 

[TimShady]

I don’t think I’m veering off topic, I’m saying focusing on a total compensation package far less than our job and in my opinion with far worse lifetime working conditions is stupid. Our job compared to theirs has the exact same entrance requirements and that’s how outsiders see it. We need to find a better argument than UPS.we will end up sounding like entitled brats.

I guess it depend a little on where you work but if I asked pretty much anyone they would say air traffic controllers should make a lot more money than UPS truck drivers.

I completely disagree that because the entrance requirements are similar “that’s how outsiders see it”. I don’t think that’s really a factor at all in peoples’ minds.

People think we have the hardest and most stressful jobs in the world. I say let them think that and use it to our advantage.

 

[Acquired Taste]

If you work for a private sector airline and your company is pulling a billion a quarter in profit then yeah you should get a piece. I hope their success helps us but we’re not the same. They also got billions in bailouts from the government to avoid getting laid off and literally the first minute that free money ran out they furloughed thousands of workers.

By socializing the losses and privatizing the gains, pilots and airlines didn't have to experience any of the risk typically associated with private employment, like your company going bankrupt and losing your job. Now, they reap the benefits of low pilot supply and high pilot demand and can demand huge increases in wages and benefits. Just another example of government interference screwing up the free market forces. It would have been "more fair" if the government didn't bail out the airlines and they had to dilute their stock, furlough/cut pilot wages, and had to restructure to survive. Then they could have raised wages and benefits as demand returned and to makeup for lost wages during the pandemic.

 

[FredSmoot]

If you work for a private sector airline and your company is pulling a billion a quarter in profit then yeah you should get a piece. I hope their success helps us but we’re not the same. They also got billions in bailouts from the government to avoid getting laid off and literally the first minute that free money ran out they furloughed thousands of workers.

The FAA budget is $15 billion dollars; so $3.75 billion per quarter…we should get a piece of that.

 

[32andBelow]

You are correct. It should have read airline pilots do almost nothing. They don’t plan their route. They don’t file flight plans. After takeoff, everything is automated. If something needs to be done they reach up and push a button or turn a dial. Can’t even be bothered to answer a radio call en-route, but heaven forbid you don’t tell them where the completely smooth rides are. My area worked sessions yesterday that if these airline unions saw, they’d advocate us to get matching raises for keeping planes safe and traffic flowing. NATCA didn’t even try to get us a dollar when we have the much more complex job. So frustrating.

I don’t think any pilot unions would be against us getting a raise. In fact natca posts about hoping that all other unions get raises just not ours.

 

[Ad1234]

I’ve seen you in a few of these threads, each time bickering incessantly against the wants of controllers. Honestly I’m curious how much time you’ve spent trying to formulate shitty arguments on how overpaid we are lmao.

Did I once say we are overpaid?

I guess it depend a little on where you work but if I asked pretty much anyone they would say air traffic controllers should make a lot more money than UPS truck drivers.

I completely disagree that because the entrance requirements are similar “that’s how outsiders see it”. I don’t think that’s really a factor at all in peoples’ minds.

People think we have the hardest and most stressful jobs in the world. I say let them think that and use it to our advantage.

If you actually look at the average total compensation, we make significantly more than they do. Level 10 and above is 6424 of the work force, 9 and above 7176, 8 and above 8128. Using rest of us locality over 8000 currently certified and not including the cpc-it, make over 100, and 6400 make over 128k, which doesn’t include any higher locality where many of these facilities are located, so that number is actually higher. Figure total compensation is EASILY above 170 with just a few years in. nearly 2/3 of the entire work force make more than ups just at certification. This comparison is fucking silly.


And to the both of you I’ll say this again for at least the 5th time this thread. We should be asking for more I’m simply saying this comparison is fucking silly.

 

[Move78]

The FAA budget is $15 billion dollars; so $3.75 billion per quarter…we should get a piece of that

That’s operating cost not profit. So again not the same thing. Delta’s “budget” is like 40 billion.

 

[32andBelow]

That’s operating cost not profit. So again not the same thing. Delta’s “budget” is like 40 billion.

Well if they are making so much they can afford a little more for services. Yesterdays price is not todays price.

 

[AB19]

By socializing the losses and privatizing the gains, pilots and airlines didn't have to experience any of the risk typically associated with private employment, like your company going bankrupt and losing your job. Now, they reap the benefits of low pilot supply and high pilot demand and can demand huge increases in wages and benefits. Just another example of government interference screwing up the free market forces. It would have been "more fair" if the government didn't bail out the airlines and they had to dilute their stock, furlough/cut pilot wages, and had to restructure to survive. Then they could have raised wages and benefits as demand returned and to makeup for lost wages during the pandemic.

Might have been the first thing you've ever said that made any sense