PHL

[DoctorSalami]

Do Area C transfers get 10% CIP?

 

[Bobson Dugnutt]

Anyone know why the CPC bid was cancelled today on USAjobs?

 

[slater]

Anyone know why the CPC bid was cancelled today on USAjobs?

PHL numbers probly improved with some EWR C side trainees who withdrew and went back to A & B sides at PHL who were CPCs at PHL already. My guess.

 

[The River]

I don't have access to the MOU in question but this has just gone public; management wants to keep the movers until July 2028.
FAA asks relocated Newark controllers to stay in Philadelphia
So they say; you work another 2 years with bonus pay and they will give you a "priority waiver to transfer to any facility in the national airspace system..."? I don't see how this is practicable from an operational standpoint considering how staffing remains intractable. Will they really get enough CPC's trained in those two years, and with enough experience to operate effectively & train new ones, so that they can allow those who were moved to transfer away? Does anyone have insight into the terms of this process and/or the thinking behind the extension?

 

[DankVectorz]

I don't have access to the MOU in question but this has just gone public; management wants to keep the movers until July 2028.
FAA asks relocated Newark controllers to stay in Philadelphia
So they say; you work another 2 years with bonus pay and they will give you a "priority waiver to transfer to any facility in the national airspace system..."? I don't see how this is practicable from an operational standpoint considering how staffing remains intractable. Will they really get enough CPC's trained in those two years, and with enough experience to operate effectively & train new ones, so that they can allow those who were moved to transfer away? Does anyone have insight into the terms of this process and/or the thinking behind the extension?

It’s not bonus money, it’s long term TDY money and not changed from the original TDY. The golden ticket transfer is the only new incentive. You can find the actual mou on Reddit. The extension is because otherwise we were going to lose 12-14 CPC’s this July and we have roughly 23ish now. The lab is now impossible to wash out from and is ridiculously unrealistic. Hell out of all the trainers in the lab only 1 ever worked in the area. We had a cpc who lost their medical for a bit so they sent them to the lab, and when they asked why are you teaching this we don’t do this the solution was to kick them out of the lab lol.

Traffic has been cut back so much at the moment that it’s pretty simple most of the time. Supervisors are certifying people that don’t have recs from their trainers. Certifying people on their 4th check ride after failing the first 3 on the same position. Certifying people that for the 3 days before the check ride their trainer had to take over every session.

Will we have enough CPC’s at the end of that 2 years when every person originally came from N90 can leave? Doubt it, but that’s the FAA’s problem. Their solution seems to be just certify everyone regardless if they should be or not. The first of the non-PHL transfer trainees are just hitting the floor now and the quality is….not what one would expect from people who have supposedly talked to planes before.

On the plus side the radio and radar issues seem to be mostly solved, it’s been a few weeks since we’ve had any glitches.

 

[bad_vector]

It’s not bonus money, it’s long term TDY money and not changed from the original TDY. The golden ticket transfer is the only new incentive. You can find the actual mou on Reddit. The extension is because otherwise we were going to lose 12-14 CPC’s this July and we have roughly 23ish now. The lab is now impossible to wash out from and is ridiculously unrealistic. Hell out of all the trainers in the lab only 1 ever worked in the area. We had a cpc who lost their medical for a bit so they sent them to the lab, and when they asked why are you teaching this we don’t do this the solution was to kick them out of the lab lol.

Traffic has been cut back so much at the moment that it’s pretty simple most of the time. Supervisors are certifying people that don’t have recs from their trainers. Certifying people on their 4th check ride after failing the first 3 on the same position. Certifying people that for the 3 days before the check ride their trainer had to take over every session.

Will we have enough CPC’s at the end of that 2 years when every person originally came from N90 can leave? Doubt it, but that’s the FAA’s problem. Their solution seems to be just certify everyone regardless if they should be or not. The first of the non-PHL transfer trainees are just hitting the floor now and the quality is….not what one would expect from people who have supposedly talked to planes before.

On the plus side the radio and radar issues seem to be mostly solved, it’s been a few weeks since we’ve had any glitches.

Award winning training program 🤣

 

[DankVectorz]

Award winning training program 🤣

The worst part is the lab is run through OKC not local management so we can’t change it. Has to go through approval by OKC before any changes can be made (like the incorrect airspace maps they somehow started with) and they mostly ignore us.

 

[mackmittens]

Traffic has been cut back so much at the moment that it’s pretty simple most of the time. Supervisors are certifying people that don’t have recs from their trainers. Certifying people on their 4th check ride after failing the first 3 on the same position. Certifying people that for the 3 days before the check ride their trainer had to take over every session.

Will we have enough CPC’s at the end of that 2 years when every person originally came from N90 can leave? Doubt it, but that’s the FAA’s problem. Their solution seems to be just certify everyone regardless if they should be or not. The first of the non-PHL transfer trainees are just hitting the floor now and the quality is….not what one would expect from people who have supposedly talked to planes before.

You should ask your ATM why she let someone convince her to not pickup a handful of Lvl 12 TRACON CPCs that are trying to transfer there.

 

[DankVectorz]

You should ask your ATM why she let someone convince her to not pickup a handful of Lvl 12 TRACON CPCs that are trying to transfer there.

Nothing our ATM does is smart or well thought out.

 

[N90-EWR]

It’s not bonus money, it’s long term TDY money and not changed from the original TDY. The golden ticket transfer is the only new incentive. You can find the actual mou on Reddit. The extension is because otherwise we were going to lose 12-14 CPC’s this July and we have roughly 23ish now. The lab is now impossible to wash out from and is ridiculously unrealistic. Hell out of all the trainers in the lab only 1 ever worked in the area. We had a cpc who lost their medical for a bit so they sent them to the lab, and when they asked why are you teaching this we don’t do this the solution was to kick them out of the lab lol.

Traffic has been cut back so much at the moment that it’s pretty simple most of the time. Supervisors are certifying people that don’t have recs from their trainers. Certifying people on their 4th check ride after failing the first 3 on the same position. Certifying people that for the 3 days before the check ride their trainer had to take over every session.

Will we have enough CPC’s at the end of that 2 years when every person originally came from N90 can leave? Doubt it, but that’s the FAA’s problem. Their solution seems to be just certify everyone regardless if they should be or not. The first of the non-PHL transfer trainees are just hitting the floor now and the quality is….not what one would expect from people who have supposedly talked to planes before.

On the plus side the radio and radar issues seem to be mostly solved, it’s been a few weeks since we’ve had any glitches.

Are you planning on using that golden ticket to go elsewhere after you finish this new extension? I hope so, because by what you’re describing…..those new controllers are going to be very weak. That operation will never go back to normal (the old normal I mean).

 

[DankVectorz]

Are you planning on using that golden ticket to go elsewhere after you finish this new extension? I hope so, because by what you’re describing…..those new controllers are going to be very weak. That operation will never go back to normal (the old normal I mean).

I was a permanent volunteer, not TDY. I’ve had the golden ticket since the beginning (usable after 3 years with up to 12 month release). We don’t know if we’re going to use it or not. Can’t really think of anywhere we really want to go, especially now that my daughter will be in school by then.

The operation is laughable now, especially to anyone who was in the area pre-COVID. The FAA has cut back traffic levels so much that if it ever does return to normal some people are going to be in for a rude awakening. They certified someone on mugzy the other day with a 15 rate.

 

[Kappa468]

Two random somewhat related to this post questions-

1. Do people that transfer to PHL area C on the USAJOBS bid from other FAA facilities not N90 get any of the incentives that the TDY’s get or just transfer money?
2. Does N90 still get the enhanced CIP/bonuses when people certify?

 

[DankVectorz]

Two random somewhat related to this post questions-

1. Do people that transfer to PHL area C on the USAJOBS bid from other FAA facilities not N90 get any of the incentives that the TDY’s get or just transfer money?
2. Does N90 still get the enhanced CIP/bonuses when people certify?

No, transfers don’t get the TDY incentives because…they’re not TDY. The only people who get check out bonuses are the trainee and the training team at time of check out. And unless it extends no one who transfers in now will get the check out bonus because it will expire before they check out. But everyone here gets the CIP per the MOU schedule.

 

[N90-EWR]

I was a permanent volunteer, not TDY. I’ve had the golden ticket since the beginning (usable after 3 years with up to 12 month release). We don’t know if we’re going to use it or not. Can’t really think of anywhere we really want to go, especially now that my daughter will be in school by then.

The operation is laughable now, especially to anyone who was in the area pre-COVID. The FAA has cut back traffic levels so much that if it ever does return to normal some people are going to be in for a rude awakening. They certified someone on mugzy the other day with a 15 rate.

I’d recommend Charlotte! Still a Level 12, lower cost of living area, nicer weather and the operation is nowhere near as screwed up.

 

[DankVectorz]

I’d recommend Charlotte! Still a Level 12, lower cost of living area, nicer weather and the operation is nowhere near as screwed up.

That was our original plan because we had a bunch of friends in Charlotte but they’ve all since moved to Atlanta where we have zero desire to go. Plus real estate in Charlotte is even more expensive than where we are now and higher income tax. But we love our new house and our neighborhood and the schools are really good so instead of being happy at work but miserable where I live I’ll just be miserable at work and happy with where I live. And it’s cheap enough here and taxes are less that I can work half the overtime I did at N90 and still take home more.

 

[Bobson Dugnutt]

No, transfers don’t get the TDY incentives because…they’re not TDY. The only people who get check out bonuses are the trainee and the training team at time of check out. And unless it extends no one who transfers in now will get the check out bonus because it will expire before they check out. But everyone here gets the CIP per the MOU schedule.

No, transfers don’t get the TDY incentives because…they’re not TDY. The only people who get check out bonuses are the trainee and the training team at time of check out. And unless it extends no one who transfers in now will get the check out bonus because it will expire before they check out. But everyone here gets the CIP per the MOU schedule.

So for someone transferring in, what’s does the CIP look like? From old reddit posts it appears 15% for 2 years (almost over), then 13% for another 2 years.

 

[32andBelow]

That was our original plan because we had a bunch of friends in Charlotte but they’ve all since moved to Atlanta where we have zero desire to go. Plus real estate in Charlotte is even more expensive than where we are now and higher income tax. But we love our new house and our neighborhood and the schools are really good so instead of being happy at work but miserable where I live I’ll just be miserable at work and happy with where I live. And it’s cheap enough here and taxes are less that I can work half the overtime I did at N90 and still take home more.

Can you use your transfer to go work in the tower and try something new?

 

[DankVectorz]

Can you use your transfer to go work in the tower and try something new?

I don’t THINK so, but switching to the other areas in the building has been something we’ve thought of. Nobody has asked for clarification yet.

 

[N90-EWR]

I don’t THINK so, but switching to the other areas in the building has been something we’ve thought of. Nobody has asked for clarification yet.

Yeah, that could be a viable escape as well. Knowing what I know about the EWR area, there’s no way I’d want to work in that area with the present conditions and knowing it’s likely to get worse. Hopefully they’ll allow that internal area transfer. Good luck!

 

[DankVectorz]

Yeah, that could be a viable escape as well. Knowing what I know about the EWR area, there’s no way I’d want to work in that area with the present conditions and knowing it’s likely to get worse. Hopefully they’ll allow that internal area transfer. Good luck!

The problem is the PHL is super over staffed. A LOT of people came in initially who were supposed to go to the EWR side but the FAA sent them 2 years before the move happened so just gave them to PHL instead. Not uncommon to see multiple people on the PHL side working a 10 hour day with 2 hours on positon total.