Facility Downgrades / Upgrades

[Anti_window_licker]

The book does say we provide service on a first come first served basis. I'm not going to delay a king air for 10 minutes just to put him out behind all the jets. I'm sorry M98 doesn't want to work hard but if I need to... I'll grab my headset and come downstairs and show you guys how it's done.

No, instead you’ll launch the king air and then shoot a jet up their ass and pass the problem onto the tracon. Come on down, we might be able to turn a you into a controller!

 

[TRACONbeatsFSSonastick]

Someone is just mad that they were downgraded to a 10 for the past two years while the tower still rocked the 11.

MK as they would say on Ozark "You don't know shit about FUCK!"

The book does say we provide service on a first come first served basis. I'm not going to delay a king air for 10 minutes just to put him out behind all the jets. I'm sorry M98 doesn't want to work hard but if I need to... I'll grab my headset and come downstairs and show you guys how it's done.

Thanks for your comment, but the Core 30 airports are talking!

 

[Smitty]

DTW getting that downgrade to a level 9!! Two weeks from this Sunday.

Why did NATCA allow a complexity formula that ensures massively more downgraes than upgrades!?? The DTW Members dues are going to make the N90 FatCats rich, while they are diminished. We are living in Dark days.

 

[Mike Kilo]

Thanks for your comment, but the Core 30 airports are talking!

I heard after MSP drops to a nine it will be a feeder for GFK, the new CORE 30 airport that replaces it.

 

[Soul_Controller]

do upgrades/downgrades get announced ahead of time ? Asking for ERR/release date purposes

Upgrades are pretty simple. Just look for any facility that's been above the buffer for 8 or 9 months (I forget which). They end up getting upgraded the next month. There was a DLH guy crying up thread about upgrades, but as long as you aren't a center there's nothing political about upgrades.

Downgrades on the other hand are way more unpredictable.

 

[BigEggplant]

My facility is below the buffer since Jul 2020.

When will we find out about a downgrade?

 

[echster]

Every facility is different in that some will see traffic come back and some will not see traffic comes back. Heck, some facilities have already seen traffic come back or exceed pre-COVID numbers. That said, there is a lot that goes into a downgrade because of the money involved... and a fall in traffic because of COVID muddles the equation further. Remember, TCI is a rolling calculation, not a static calculation. As time goes on, and those COVID traffic count days are replaced by better numbers, TCIs should (theoretically) increase.

If there is a chance your facility will reach the TCI or TCI buffer to keep the pre-COVID higher level, you're unlikely to be downgraded. Why? Because a downgrade lets you save pay, IIRC, for two years. And when that traffic comes back to pre-COVID levels, they will owe you another 6% (or 8%) pay raise or the bottom of the band, whichever is higher, for the upgrade.

For all the craziness that is the Agency, even they are not crazy enough to downgrade a facility, where folks save pay... and then turn around and upgrade that facility back to where it was pre-COVID while providing everyone the CBA increase in level pay raise.

 

[FightingIrish2012]

My facility is below the buffer since Jul 2020.

When will we find out about a downgrade?

You at a NYC area facility? Then don’t worry, you are all good.

 

[GulfBravoPapa]

My facility is below the buffer since Jul 2020.

When will we find out about a downgrade?

I believe the next meeting is in Sept. However if the validation team is not already talking to your ATM and rep and requesting documentation and traffic projections you're fine.

 

[BigEggplant]

You at a NYC area facility? Then don’t worry, you are all good.

That’s what I’m wondering, we are way busier than Kennedy for instance, can’t imagine going down to their level.

I believe the next meeting is in Sept. However if the validation team is not already talking to your ATM and rep and requesting documentation and traffic projections you're fine.

I guess my concern is, I don’t see the traffic picking up to pre-COVID levels really until next year or even 2024. To top it off we’ve had something like 10-12% of our gates closed at any given time due to massive construction.

 

[COWTOWN]

I guess my concern is, I don’t see the traffic picking up to pre-COVID levels really until next year or even 2024. To top it off we’ve had something like 10-12% of our gates closed at any given time due to massive construction.

Must be LAX. Nice!

 

[dc2006]

DTW getting that downgrade to a level 9!! Two weeks from this Sunday.

Is D21 going to remain an 11?

 

[GulfBravoPapa]

Is D21 going to remain an 11?

For now they are. To be reevaluated in Sept.

 

[HenryTheAce]

Is D21 going to remain an 11?

We’re officially being looked at in Sept., they contacted our ATM for info.. looking at the numbers we’re well within a level 10 and have been hanging in the buffer between a 10/11 for years and years. I imagine we’ll be getting that downgrade to 10

 

[Smitty]

I imagine we’ll be getting that downgrade to 10

Sad.

At what point is a system that sees something like 6-1 or 7-1 downgrades to upgrades going to be shit canned and reevaluated ? Yet we are told the CBA is as good as it gets. After all the other BS of the past few years a downgrade would be the icing on the cake. I don't think the fat cats in the eastern region (how many years was JFK below the threshold but never dow graded...) realize how demoralizing it is to be downgraded. Or maybe do and don't care.

 

[boots]

Sad.

At what point is a system that sees something like 6-1 or 7-1 downgrades to upgrades going to be shit canned and reevaluated ? Yet we are told the CBA is as good as it gets. After all the other BS of the past few years a downgrade would be the icing on the cake. I don't think the fat cats in the eastern region (how many years was JFK below the threshold but never dow graded...) realize how demoralizing it is to be downgraded. Or maybe do and don't care.

jfk at least 10 years

 

[Soul_Controller]

Since 2016 it's 67 downgrades to 65 upgrades.

The only thing that really bugs me about TCI is that the number is almost too stable. The reality is that you'll be working your next level traffic numbers for damn near a year before it the TCI catches up. (in fairness, the reverse is true to)

 

[Caerbannog]

Since 2016 it's 67 downgrades to 65 upgrades.

The only thing that really bugs me about TCI is that the number is almost too stable. The reality is that you'll be working your next level traffic numbers for damn near a year before it the TCI catches up. (in fairness, the reverse is true to)

Unless you know you do a consolidation and work traffic two levels above instantly for like 3 years waiting for a ridiculous average to catch up while they figure out how to not hold a meeting on their laptops. The contract is broken for consolidations.

 

[Logical_Mongoose]

Since 2016 it's 67 downgrades to 65 upgrades.

By 67 and 65 are talking about the amount of levels gained and lost, or only the amount of changes that took place? Did GRR going from a 7 to a 5 count as 1 downgrade because it only changed once or did it count as 2 because it tracks the levels lost individually?

 

[Soul_Controller]

By 67 and 65 are talking about the amount of levels gained and lost, or only the amount of changes that took place? Did GRR going from a 7 to a 5 count as 1 downgrade because it only changed once or did it count as 2 because it tracks the levels lost individually?

My count would have only counted that once.