What's the deal with ERR vs. hardships?

[Even Steven]

Hey, all:

I've been doing a lot of research on this site, and I'm genuinely curious as to how to people manage to get to the facility they want to be.

OK, so I know those fortunate enough to get to the FAA Academy are either given (1) En-route or (2) Tower/TRACON.

Scenario 1: En-Route

Let's say someone wants Tower/TRACON but gets En-route.

Let's say they pass the training and get sent to -- God forbid -- ZOA.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but from my understanding, the general progression is you certify at your facility first and then file an ERR.

And if that facility's staffing level is below the national average of 85%, then Godspeed because you're handcuffed for all eternity.

So to get around this, I've read trainees (who haven't certified) make up bogus "hardship" claims, like "allergies," to bypass those who've paid their dues and served their time.

And these trainees then get to "cherry-pick" the facility they want to go to.

Is this true? For example, can trainees claim a hardship, bypass those with ERRs and go from ZOA or wherever to a level 9+ tower anywhere they want?

Scenario 2: Tower/TRACON

Let's say someone does get Tower/TRACON.

What would be the fastest way for them to end up where they want to live?

Is the progression to try to finish first in your class and pick a tower -- from the priority list -- with (1) a high staffing rate, (2) a high training success rate and (3) a low training time to get to where you want to be without having to claim a hardship?

What's my end game?

Well, the bottom line is Orlando, Florida, is my home, and if I'm fortunate enough to make it through all the hoops, then I eventually want to return home and work at either MCO Tower or F11 (Central Florida TRACON).

Last question I have, which I'm still a little confused about, is about NCEPT.

I still need to do a little more digging on NCEPT, but:

(A) What is it?
(B) What does it do?
(C) Why is it hated so much?

I know this long, but I'm hoping experienced folks can chime in so others, who are also curious, have access and answers to all of these questions in one thread.

Thanks!

 

[Move78]

Hey, all:

I've been doing a lot of research on this site, and I'm genuinely curious as to how to people manage to get to the facility they want to be.

OK, so I know those fortunate enough to get to the FAA Academy are either given (1) En-route or (2) Tower/TRACON.

Scenario 1: En-Route

Let's say someone wants Tower/TRACON but gets En-route.

Let's say they pass the training and get sent to -- God forbid -- ZOA.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but from my understanding, the general progression is you certify at your facility first and then file an ERR.

And if that facility's staffing level is below the national average of 85%, then Godspeed because you're handcuffed for all eternity.

So to get around this, I've read trainees (who haven't certified) make up bogus "hardship" claims, like "allergies," to bypass those who've paid their dues and served their time.

And these trainees then get to "cherry-pick" the facility they want to go to.

Is this true? For example, can trainees claim a hardship, bypass those with ERRs and go from ZOA or wherever to a level 9+ tower anywhere they want?

Scenario 2: Tower/TRACON

Let's say someone does get Tower/TRACON.

What would be the fastest way for them to end up where they want to live?

Is the progression to try to finish first in your class and pick a tower -- from the priority list -- with (1) a high staffing rate, (2) a high training success rate and (3) a low training time to get to where you want to be without having to claim a hardship?

What's my end game?

Well, the bottom line is Orlando, Florida, is my home, and if I'm fortunate enough to make it through all the hoops, then I eventually want to return home and work at either MCO Tower or F11 (Central Florida TRACON).

Last question I have, which I'm still a little confused about, is about NCEPT.

I still need to do a little more digging on NCEPT, but:

(A) What is it?
(B) What does it do?
(C) Why is it hated so much?

I know this long, but I'm hoping experienced folks can chime in so others, who are also curious, have access and answers to all of these questions in one thread.

Thanks!

This poor mf

 

[Even Steven]

This poor mf

Dude, if anything, I've proven I've done my homework and laid out the loopholes clearly.

"Don't hate the player, hate the game," as some of you like to say.

I'm just inquiring.

You could've just answered the question instead of being an ass.

 

[Unable is a full sentence]

The next test for hardships should be political affiliation. Someone could argue pressure from an affiliation of a certain state and apply to an opposite color state to avoid the extreme political bias against them.

I mean, people could easily get to California or New York this way if they're feeling that hate from certain states.

 

[32andBelow]

Hardships work and ERRs don’t.

 

[Even Steven]

The next test for hardships should be political affiliation. Someone could argue pressure from an affiliation of a certain state and apply to an opposite color state to avoid the extreme political bias against them.

I mean, people could easily get to California or New York this way if they're feeling that hate from certain states.

OK. Let's forget about bogus hardships for a sec.

If it's a legit hardship, could a trainee bypass others to get to their chosen facility that would eliminate the hardship?

 

[32andBelow]

OK. Let's forget about bogus hardships for a sec.

If it's a legit hardship, could a trainee bypass others to get to their chosen facility that would eliminate the hardship?

Yah but you don’t get to choose a facility. If approved you get to choose a location and they can give you any facility within however many miles of that location.

 

[Even Steven]

Yah but you don’t get to choose a facility. If approved you get to choose a location and they can give you any facility within however many miles of that location.

Oh, I see. Has that always been the case cuz I was under the impression that people have been able to go wherever they wanted?

For example, my mom is considered a disabled person.

She can't work.

She recently had breast cancer (now in remission) and skin cancer.

And she has a whole host of other medical conditions.

She's not married, and I'm her only child.

The powers that be won't approve a home attendant, so I want to come back home to be close and take care of her.

Would that qualify as a hardship if there's overwhelming paperwork?

Hardships work and ERRs don’t.

Do ERRs work if you certify at a facility that doesn't need you/has a high staffing rate?

 

[32andBelow]

Oh, I see. Has that always been the case cuz I was under the impression that people have been able to go wherever they wanted?

For example, my mom is considered a disabled person.

She can't work.

She recently had breast cancer (now in remission) and skin cancer.

And she has a whole host of other medical conditions.

She's not married, and I'm her only child.

The powers that be won't approve a home attendant, so I want to come back home to be close and take care of her.

Would that qualify as a hardship if there's overwhelming paperwork?

Yah so if you say you need to be in Los Angeles they might offer you ZLA or BUR or CMA. Wherever they have an opening. You don’t just get to pick anything

 

[Even Steven]

Yah so if you say you need to be in Los Angeles they might offer you ZLA or BUR or CMA. Wherever they have an opening. You don’t just get to pick anything

Oh, I see. Thanks!

I just gave the ZOA example, but I'm actually from Orlando.

So if I were to get ZOA or whatever and file a hardship, they would offer me facilities in Orlando, but I just wouldn't get to choose, right?

If so, that works for me.

Don't care so much about the facility but actually being home and looking after my ma.

 

[Phanatical]

Do ERRs work if you certify at a facility that doesn't need you/has a high staffing rate?

There are a lot of variables that go into ERR selection. Primarily yeah, the place you are at needs to be able to release you, and the place you want to go has to be able to pick you up. However, other factors like ATM Rankings have the ability to play into the process. It’s not as simple as checking boxes, but certain parameters are required to be met.

 

[Even Steven]

There are a lot of variables that go into ERR selection. Primarily yeah, the place you are at needs to be able to release you, and the place you want to go has to be able to pick you up. However, other factors like ATM Rankings have the ability to play into the process. It’s not as simple as checking boxes, but certain parameters are required to be met.

Thanks.

Btw, what are ATM rankings? Is that the same as the priority list?

 

[Phanatical]

Don't care so much about the facility but actually being home and looking after my ma.

I really don’t want this next bit to sound the way it’s going to sound, but the reality of it is...

you agree on your application that you are willing to work at any facility within the NAS based on agency needs. If you’re a new hire, they could care less about your family needs. They need staffing.

 

[Even Steven]

I really don’t want this next bit to sound the way it’s going to sound, but the reality of it is...

you agree on your application that you are willing to work at any facility within the NAS based on agency needs. If you’re a new hire, they could care less about your family needs. They need staffing.

Nah. I get you.

I'm just saying other people go into it knowing they checked that box too, knowing they might file a hardship.

And if it gets denied, then you just roll with the punches and somehow make it work.

 

[Phanatical]

Nah. I get you.

I'm just saying other people go into it knowing they checked that box too, knowing they might file a hardship.

And if it gets denied, then you just roll with the punches and somehow make it work.

Welcome to the FAA.

 

[32andBelow]

You still have to pass the academy

 

[Even Steven]

You still have to pass the academy

*I still have to get into the academy.

So yeah, I'm aware I'm getting way ahead of myself, but knowledge is power.

Meanwhile, I'm studying my ass off with JobTestPrep's ATSA pack and playing the waiting game for this year's OTS bid.

 

[the inquirer]

*I still have to get into the academy.

So yeah, I'm aware I'm getting way ahead of myself, but knowledge is power.

Meanwhile, I'm studying my ass off with JobTestPrep's ATSA pack and playing the waiting game for this year's OTS bid.

Bro, people have aged out waiting to get hired by the FAA. I hope you’ve got a different career going at the moment....
Cuz it sounds like you really banking on getting hired....

 

[Even Steven]

Bro, people have aged out waiting to get hired by the FAA. I hope you’ve got a different career going at the moment....
Cuz it sounds like you really banking on getting hired....

I do.

I’m still young, and I’m finishing up my master’s degree in something entirely unrelated to aviation.

 

[jamisjockey]

I do.

I’m still young, and I’m finishing up my master’s degree in something entirely unrelated to aviation.

Gender studies?