Duffy Says: Age Increase, Raise & Safer? Offer Coming?

[slater]

Thoughts? I'm curious....

"I can offer them the chance to stay longer past the mandatory retirement age of 56, pay them more...make the system safer, alleviate the pressure on the controllers."


Info: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us...ered-chance-stay-longer-says-duffy-2025-02-07

 

[Hallock36]

Cool but I haven’t met a ton of controllers who are being forced out that still have it though. They almost all have been washed up a while and usually scam the cru art to work what position when they want to. You want to make them supervisors or something, fine but they shouldn’t be the ones we count on to improve staffing.

 

[32andBelow]

If they only pay people over 56 that would be something.

 

[Move78]

Extending 56 is the plan you come up with when you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.

 

[EEKK]

Secretary Duffy brought up the two most important things that membership wants, more pay and better retirement.
First age 56 should really be 57. Vision 100 retirement (get 1.7% for every year worked) requires us to work at least 30 years and until the MRA. The MRA many years ago was 56. It was phased out and increased to 57. Our FERS retirement never amended the rules to match that. Currently the only way to get 1.7% every year is to get at least one extension. This can be corrected immediately working with Duffy.
As for any pay attached to staying past 56... This is where the Union needs to take off running. Our stance should have been, great more money for working past 56 is good but thats just a start. How about better pay to attract more controllers and staff the NAS. Pay controllers who actually work traffic more and not incentivize them to take staff jobs or defect elsewhere. Pay controllers a higher amount to train. Even go as far as the N90 plan where when a trainee becomes CPC the whole area get a bonus. Stress the stress of our work and get more time off. We currently have an administration that is willing to turn everything upside down with the stroke of a pen. We should use that and the DCA accident to take advantage and finally get compensated properly for the job we do.

Here was part of the Union's response to Duffy...
When we are officially presented, as required by law and our Collective Bargaining Agreement, to negotiate any financial incentives being offered to the ATC workforce, we will seek agreement on proposals to mitigate the current ATC shortage and build the ATC workforce of the future.

Duffy wants to talk pay and retirement now. The Union needs to kick open the door he just opened!

 

[GMX]

Age 56+ aside, does anyone think they have considered a plan to keep people past age 50 at this point?

 

[SolicitSVFR]

Secretary Duffy brought up the two most important things that membership wants, more pay and better retirement.
First age 56 should really be 57. Vision 100 retirement (get 1.7% for every year worked) requires us to work at least 30 years and until the MRA. The MRA many years ago was 56. It was phased out and increased to 57. Our FERS retirement never amended the rules to match that. Currently the only way to get 1.7% every year is to get at least one extension. This can be corrected immediately working with Duffy.
As for any pay attached to staying past 56... This is where the Union needs to take off running. Our stance should have been, great more money for working past 56 is good but thats just a start. How about better pay to attract more controllers and staff the NAS. Pay controllers who actually work traffic more and not incentivize them to take staff jobs or defect elsewhere. Pay controllers a higher amount to train. Even go as far as the N90 plan where when a trainee becomes CPC the whole area get a bonus. Stress the stress of our work and get more time off. We currently have an administration that is willing to turn everything upside down with the stroke of a pen. We should use that and the DCA accident to take advantage and finally get compensated properly for the job we do.

Here was part of the Union's response to Duffy...
When we are officially presented, as required by law and our Collective Bargaining Agreement, to negotiate any financial incentives being offered to the ATC workforce, we will seek agreement on proposals to mitigate the current ATC shortage and build the ATC workforce of the future.

Duffy wants to talk pay and retirement now. The Union needs to kick open the door he just opened!

Vision 100 is subject to the earnings test for the fers supplement, which makes it a wash and no better than retiring under normal ATC retirement imo. Also an extension is not required, go work staff support, post office, or any other federal job that last year until age 57.


“How the Earnings Test Works
The earnings test functions similarly to the Social Security earnings test. Here's how it operates:

1. There is an exempt amount that can change yearly. For the current earnings amount, visitU.S. Office of Personnel Management - www.OPM.gov. For the year 2024, the amount was $$22,320. Remember, the actual calculation of the FERS Supplement can be complex, and online calculators may not capture all the nuances of your specific situation or the current year's rules.
2. For every $2 earned above this exempt amount, the FERS Supplement is reduced by $1.
3. The reduction is applied on a monthly basis to the supplement payment.”

 

[EEKK]

Vision 100 is subject to the earnings test for the fers supplement, which makes it a wash and no better than retiring under normal ATC retirement imo. Also an extension is not required, go work staff support, post office, or any other federal job that last year until age 57.


“How the Earnings Test Works
The earnings test functions similarly to the Social Security earnings test. Here's how it operates:

1. There is an exempt amount that can change yearly. For the current earnings amount, visitU.S. Office of Personnel Management - www.OPM.gov. For the year 2024, the amount was $$22,320. Remember, the actual calculation of the FERS Supplement can be complex, and online calculators may not capture all the nuances of your specific situation or the current year's rules.
2. For every $2 earned above this exempt amount, the FERS Supplement is reduced by $1.
3. The reduction is applied on a monthly basis to the supplement payment.”

ATC Vision 100 only pays you 1.7% per year for front line ATC duties. Staff and other duties do not qualify for the 1.7%.
You can work until 57 as staff but you only get 1% for those years.
Our retirement system in based on the MRA. We should be allowed to work until at least 57 to match that. Of course if you want to retire earlier than its also great. We should have as many options available as possible.

Vision 100 is subject to the earnings test for the fers supplement, which makes it a wash and no better than retiring under normal ATC retirement imo. Also an extension is not required, go work staff support, post office, or any other federal job that last year until age 57.


“How the Earnings Test Works
The earnings test functions similarly to the Social Security earnings test. Here's how it operates:

1. There is an exempt amount that can change yearly. For the current earnings amount, visitU.S. Office of Personnel Management - www.OPM.gov. For the year 2024, the amount was $$22,320. Remember, the actual calculation of the FERS Supplement can be complex, and online calculators may not capture all the nuances of your specific situation or the current year's rules.
2. For every $2 earned above this exempt amount, the FERS Supplement is reduced by $1.
3. The reduction is applied on a monthly basis to the supplement payment.”

Also Vision 100 has nothing to do with the supplement. In order to get and keep the supplement you have an earnings test whether you are Vision 100 or not. Than lasts until you are 62 and get SS.

 

[Gauff]

Extending 56 is the plan you come up with when you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.

Because he doesn't know what he's doing is exactly why NATCA should be telling him what is needed before the FAA does and they say we don't need more pay.

 

[SolicitSVFR]

Also Vision 100 has nothing to do with the supplement. In order to get and keep the supplement you have an earnings test whether you are Vision 100 or not. Than lasts until you are 62 and get SS.

You need to look this up man. There is no earnings test until age 57 retiring under special provision FERS retirement, aka normal ATC retirement. There IS an earnings test for vision 100. Top it off with no cola for vision 100 until 62 while normal ATC retirement gets the cola. Doesn’t seem all that great

ATC Vision 100 only pays you 1.7% per year for front line ATC duties. Staff and other duties do not qualify for the 1.7%.
You can work until 57 as staff but you only get 1% for those years.
Our retirement system in based on the MRA. We should be allowed to work until at least 57 to match that. Of course if you want to retire earlier than its also great. We should have as many options available as possible.

I understand this but an extension is very hard to get. Under vision 100 you get 1.7% for all years worked good time. So here’s a hypothetical scenario. You join the FAA at age 25 and work until 56. That’s 31 years at 1.7%. Then you work staff support or any other federal job until age 57. That’s one year at 1% and meets the vision 100 requirements. So in total you get 31 years x 1.7% and 1 year x 1%

 

[EEKK]

You need to look this up man. There is no earnings test retiring under special provision FERS retirement, aka normal ATC retirement. There IS an earnings test for vision 100.


I understand this but an extension is very hard to get. Under vision 100 you get 1.7% for all years worked good time. So here’s a hypothetical scenario. You join the FAA at age 25 and work until 56. That’s 31 years at 1.7%. Then you work staff support or any other federal job until age 57. That’s

Every person who gets the supplement is subject to the earnings test between the ages of 56 and 62!!!
Regular retirement or Vision 100.
If the MRA goes up to 57 than everyone is subject to the earnings test from 57-62.
57 is a win all the way around.

The working until 57 example is correct. But not everyone can get a staff job for a year to make it to 57.
We should have the option to work until 57. It needs to match the MRA like it did many years ago.

 

[GulfBravoPapa]

How about we not change the retirement age because that's a very slippery slope.

Very few controllers work until 56 anyway so the whole discussion is basically a moot point. What did Natca put out? In the next 12 months there are only 49 controllers who will turn 56? Not helpful.

 

[SolicitSVFR]

Every person who gets the supplement is subject to the earnings test!!!!!!
Regular retirement or Vision 100.

The working until 57 example is correct. But not everyone can get a staff job for a year to make it to 57.
We should have the option to work until 57. It needs to match the MRA like it did many years ago.

Yeah but say you joined at age 25 and retired at 50. No earnings test for 7 years until age 57. Also vision 100 no cola until age 62

 

[the inquirer]

correct me if I’m wrong, if you do MRA+30 you take the gamble of not getting the cola increases on your supplement. I know guys who retired in the past couple years that got an extension to 57 and it was a wash because of the higher cola increases the past few years. Could have not worked as long, but had a similar take home.

 

[SolicitSVFR]

correct me if I’m wrong, if you do MRA+30 you take the gamble of not getting the cola increases on your supplement. I know guys who retired in the past couple years that got an extension to 57 and it was a wash because of the higher cola increases the past few years. Could have not worked as long, but had a similar take home.

I mentioned this above but yes, this exactly. No cola for vision 100/mra+30 until 62

 

[EEKK]

When you retire you get to choose if you want regular or Vision 100.
I don’t know of one person who has elected regular over V100.

Anyway the whole point is Duffy wants to talk. This administration is changing everything. How about the Union joining in.

 

[SolicitSVFR]

The only benefit I can see for vision 100 is if you worked ATC for under the minimum time it takes to get fers special retirement. Which is 20/50 or 25/any age. If you worked ATC for 10 years for example and are burned out of the career and switch to bad a time job the rest of your career. Then you get 1.7% x 10 years and the rest at 1%

 

[Phillytroll69]

Can someone run the example.
Retire at 57 with 30 years
Retire at 55 with 29 years

Maybe it exists but I'm not understanding the cola adjustments, social security supplement, etc

 

[SolicitSVFR]

Can someone run the example.
Retire at 57 with 30 years
Retire at 55 with 29 years

Maybe it exists but I'm not understanding the cola adjustments, social security supplement, etc

1st example assuming youre retiring vision 100 = 30 years x 1.7%. 51% pension. No fers supplement. No cola until 62

2nd example normal ATC retirement = 20 years x 1.7% and 9 years x 1%. 43% pension. Fers supplement for two years until age 57 then it’s subject to earnings test which means basically every ATC will lose the fers supplement past age 57. Cola immediately upon retirement. You’ll need to crunch those numbers individually what they mean for you. Normal ATC retirement is better the earlier you retire I believe because you get the fers supplement longer and the immediate cola, but thats my honest assessment

 

[EEKK]

Can someone run the example.
Retire at 57 with 30 years
Retire at 55 with 29 years

Maybe it exists but I'm not understanding the cola adjustments, social security supplement, etc

Can someone run the example.
Retire at 57 with 30 years
Retire at 55 with 29 years

Maybe it exists but I'm notunderstanding the cola adjustments, social security supplement, etc

51

Can someone run the example.
Retire at 57 with 30 years
Retire at 55 with 29 years

Maybe it exists but I'm not understanding the cola adjustments, social security supplement, etc