Training hold

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FightingIrish2012

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I actually do think it’s a outdated and bad practice, the no person left behind, all or nothing stuff you traditionally have seen with unions the last 100 years. That logic does apply to some things but not everything and certainly not here.

Training should be happening in the facilities where it is possible to train. To not do so I like the guy in charge of the life boat loading on Titanic saying “fuck it” when it hit the iceberg and intentionally dumping every life boat in the ocean because there would only have been space to save 70%, so why not everyone just go down?
 

32andBelow

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I actually do think it’s a outdated and bad practice, the no person left behind, all or nothing stuff you traditionally have seen with unions the last 100 years. That logic does apply to some things but not everything and certainly not here.

Training should be happening in the facilities where it is possible to train. To not do so I like the guy in charge of the life boat loading on Titanic saying “fuck it” when it hit the iceberg and intentionally dumping every life boat in the ocean because there would only have been space to save 70%, so why not everyone just go down?
They are literally just afraid to lose these schedules. That’s it.
 

Stinger

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FAA national answer: training is an all or nothing thing. National level decision. There's 300+ FAA facilities. If one facility gets to make a "I'm a special case because of" reason to start training, the rest of the facilities will do the same thing. No ATM wants to be the one that isn't training when the one next door is doing OJT.

Which is crazy thinking, because they count on the service area and district level to keep facilities in line. But by doing a national decision on training, they're effectively saying "we can't count on any ATM to make a decision, so we'll do it for them."
 

ClearanceClarence

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FAA national answer: training is an all or nothing thing. National level decision. There's 300+ FAA facilities. If one facility gets to make a "I'm a special case because of" reason to start training, the rest of the facilities will do the same thing. No ATM wants to be the one that isn't training when the one next door is doing OJT.

Which is crazy thinking, because they count on the service area and district level to keep facilities in line. But by doing a national decision on training, they're effectively saying "we can't count on any ATM to make a decision, so we'll do it for them."
So based on this philosophy, the entire country can’t train until it’s “safe” to do so literally everywhere? There’s going to be hot spots popping up until there’s a vaccine, possibly longer. The idea that a small tower in a county with 0 corona cases can’t train because there’s a spike in LA or Miami is insane.
 

Stinger

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So based on this philosophy, the entire country can’t train until it’s “safe” to do so literally everywhere? There’s going to be hot spots popping up until there’s a vaccine, possibly longer. The idea that a small tower in a county with 0 corona cases can’t train because there’s a spike in LA or Miami is insane.
As of now... That's correct.
Hopefully it changes, but who knows.
 

tink

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Pessimists, care to weigh in on the odds of CPC-IT furloughs?

I'm becoming pessimistic about this but there'd better be some limit if that's the case ^^^

Because I'm one position away from CPC, and I would highly dislike being furloughed when I've been working and getting my ass kicked a lot of days because we're social distancing but definitely have enough traffic to train/get ass kicked regularly. AND getting paid less than my co-workers next to me, yet the same pay as those who got to stay at home for 4 months because they only have FD/1 position.

Being useful *to a point* is morale busting.
 

ClearanceClarence

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As of now... That's correct.
Hopefully it changes, but who knows.
Is there any indication of what the gating criteria is for them to base these decisions off? Like do they want new cases nationally to hit a certain average number, or are they literally looking at every county that has an ATC facility and waiting for each one to get below some type of threshold? If it’s the second option, we literally might not be training for the rest of the year.
 

Stinger

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Is there any indication of what the gating criteria is for them to base these decisions off? Like do they want new cases nationally to hit a certain average number, or are they literally looking at every county that has an ATC facility and waiting for each one to get below some type of threshold? If it’s the second option, we literally might not be training for the rest of the year.
Haven't heard. The national OJT group could be discussing all of those things. Or none of them.
 

FightingIrish2012

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I legit think that Spring 2021 is the next chance for training to start. Everytime it seems like it’s getting close something submarines it, it looks to be that way by intelligent design. Even if they push to reopen the country on November 4th the argument will be made that “it’s winter and reduced COVID traffic, got to wait until spring now”.
 

phrenetik

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I'm becoming pessimistic about this but there'd better be some limit if that's the case ^^^

Because I'm one position away from CPC, and I would highly dislike being furloughed when I've been working and getting my ass kicked a lot of days because we're social distancing but definitely have enough traffic to train/get ass kicked regularly. AND getting paid less than my co-workers next to me, yet the same pay as those who got to stay at home for 4 months because they only have FD/1 position.

Being useful *to a point* is morale busting.
I feel you man. My favorite part of this extra delay to my last 2 sectors is the CPCs that still talk trash and treat me like shit daily just because I'm still a trainee when we've been side by side working with them since march. I'm in limbo mode of getting treated like a stupid trainee at this point, while also making 30-60k less than all of them. Fun stuff
 

32andBelow

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I legit think that Spring 2021 is the next chance for training to start. Everytime it seems like it’s getting close something submarines it, it looks to be that way by intelligent design. Even if they push to reopen the country on November 4th the argument will be made that “it’s winter and reduced COVID traffic, got to wait until spring now”.
I don’t see how the faa doesn’t that while they keep pumping more and more through the academy.
 

CaptainObvious

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I feel you man. My favorite part of this extra delay to my last 2 sectors is the CPCs that still talk trash and treat me like shit daily just because I'm still a trainee when we've been side by side working with them since march. I'm in limbo mode of getting treated like a stupid trainee at this point, while also making 30-60k less than all of them. Fun stuff
Same. The par I hate most is the “are you certified yet? Stop dragging your feet” comments
 

Horny4Vectors

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FAA
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N90 New York Tracon
I legit think that Spring 2021 is the next chance for training to start. Everytime it seems like it’s getting close something submarines it, it looks to be that way by intelligent design. Even if they push to reopen the country on November 4th the argument will be made that “it’s winter and reduced COVID traffic, got to wait until spring now”.
Here’s what’s going to happen. FAA/NATCA are going to be extremely vocal in the coming weeks saying publicly “we are ready to get things moving again in the very near future”. Congress extends our funding with another CR for either the full fiscal year or ~6 months. As soon as the ink dries both will back pedal and say “we should probably wait until Spring timeframe”.
 

Phillytroll69

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FAA
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JNU Juneau Tower
I feel you man. My favorite part of this extra delay to my last 2 sectors is the CPCs that still talk trash and treat me like shit daily just because I'm still a trainee when we've been side by side working with them since march. I'm in limbo mode of getting treated like a stupid trainee at this point, while also making 30-60k less than all of them. Fun stuff
We all had to put up with it. If you hadn't of dragged your feet you'd already be done.
 
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