Soul_Controller
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He's only not protected if his ATSAP isn't accepted, and the union side of the ERC, isn't going to say a bad squeeze play shouldn't be accepted and the FAA isn't going to blow ATSAP up over this.
Holding Controllers Accountable
- Thread starter PointSixty5stalker
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Wizard
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You would be surprised
There’s a situation where the agency sort of blew it up. Maybe misused it in punitive ways after people Who shouldn’t have it we’re getting access to unredacted atsapp reports. And then using the reports against the people who filed them.
The litigation is ongoing.
You call my post stupid then admit it’s also a reality.
I’m not saying I agree with it, I’m just stating facts. As you also apparently agree with. So how could my post be stupid?
Wizard
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i guess if I almost kill 150 people I’ll be making fake p65 accounts to protect myself.
Do you feel stupid yet?
Nope. Peter gibbons agrees with me.
And what you just said is also a possibility.
Atsap is merely a way for controllers to report rather than MOR their mandatory reportable event. no protections are attached. The event can still be investigated anyway the FAA sees fit
That doesn’t include a member of the atsap team secretly giving unredacted, unprocessed reports directly from the submitter to their {person} who is a {redacted} manager who then unofficially, secretly gives the reports to an ATM who uses them against the people who submitted them, both OS and controllers.
Everyone not a victim who was involved has been Removed from their position, transferred out of the ato or “retired”
Like I said, the litigation is underway.
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Soul_Controller
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There are exceptions written into thw MOU (don't say you were drunk, or you broke the rule on purpose, etc) but the atsap program definitely acts as a shield from discipline and decertification.
No it doesn’t. Simply what you wrote in the atsap can’t be used against you.
Something like this event will include some sort of an investigation that was triggered outside of the atsap submission. Employees are only “protected” from what they say in the atsap not what the FAA determines on their own
Soul_Controller
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You can fact find all you want but odds are slim the FAA management brain trust will smoke out more info than the ERC already had.
You are talking about 2 completely different things. Atsap does not and will not protect you from Anything outside of the words you put in the atsap. If that’s the route you choose to take for a mandatory reportable event, once the agency finds out they will submit the mor then try to figure out what happened. They can still talk to you about it, investigate using other means and even give you training via atsap SET and so on and so forth. Atsap only allows you to submit some information that you don’t feel comfortable saying in any other venue. They will deny any atsap that admits any wrong doing as spelled out in the 7200.20.
I agree the FAA will most likely not find out more, but also they don’t need to to make an assessment and then make a policy if they feel the need.
I really don’t understand why people feel they need for protection anyway. Have you ever seen someone disciplined for an air traffic event that didn’t deserve it? If you are scared to sit in a room and talk about what you did, you are a pansy. Plain and simple. If you really care that your event is heavily looked at, you are a pansy.
This is the accountability many are talking about. It starts with you and leads to the rest of the culture but people are so fucking scared andof what? nothing will ever happen to you except for some training. Big fucking deal, we could all use some from time to time. Yes management and the agency can be a pain, but you aren’t losing your job, aren’t going to be decertified, and if you do you deserved it because it’s impossible to get any of those things because managment is not equipped to follow through appropriately. Say what you want about the union, but they are better at poking holes in agency bullshit in this one area.
Stop being such a bitch.
doodii
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I couldn't tell what was happening because her 7head kept reflecting the light from the floating white stages.
32andBelow
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Why are conservatives mad at Rihanna? Just cus she’s a woman or what
acutetriangles
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Yeah, pretty much
Peter Gibbons
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Usually sexy lady didn't jiggle her bits like we want because she's pregnant, much mad.
Real talk though bring back that Shakira j-lo show from a few years ago. WHEW.
WTF ru talking about?
32andBelow
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Why are you mad at Rihanna the same day trump is mad at Rhianna. Explain.
Im not mad at Rihanna, but her show was disgusting. You like seeing a pregnant woman grabbing her vagina 100 feet in the air? We have different tastes! I have no idea what Trump thing you are referencing but you should become less obsessed w him at some point LOL its been over 2 years since hes been gone bro 😉
32andBelow
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Idk I was eating wings and drinking beer and not having a meltdown over a concert
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