Hiring Bid FAA-ATO-20-ALLSRCE-65607

[Oh_Horizon]

I'm far from a person who suffers from anxiety or things like that, but I am checking my inboxes so many times a day I'm starting to convince myself that I have overlooked the CIL that we're waiting for.

I really, really just don't want to miss it. That's normal right?

 

[Zeeshan]

I know the blood pressure requirement is not more than 140/90(for the age group up to 30). Is it with or without the medication? Does anyone know?

 

[32andBelow]

I know the blood pressure requirement is not more than 140/90(for the age group up to 30). Is it with or without the medication? Does anyone know?

Pretty much everything with Medicals is just up to the flight surgeon

 

[FAABurger]

I'm far from a person who suffers from anxiety or things like that, but I am checking my inboxes so many times a day I'm starting to convince myself that I have overlooked the CIL that we're waiting for.

I really, really just don't want to miss it. That's normal right?

I’m sure it’ll be a while.

There’s a massive backlog of trainees from 2019 bid that are still trying to get into the academy. So they need to check out, plus (from what i’m seeing) is the MMPI. This has to be done at an ATC facility. With the new OJT guide from the FAA, a facility needs to be “green or orange” for 2+ weeks to allow trainees in for the MMPI. IIRC only Hawaii and NJ meet this criteria currently.

I’d say get comfortable, my guess is mid-December we will get a CIL. If you look at the 2019 bid you can look at peoples signatures to get a feel for a rough timeline, but with COVID being so unpredictable, it’s hard to accurately gauge a timeline.

 

[Drewzer]

Why even have OKC in the first place? Why not just send everyone through the CIL process, and if you check those boxes, send them to a term/Enroute facility. They have to go through the stages at their respective facility anyway Like basics/map study admin stuff then D side etc etc then Evals which is basically OKC anyway. The Academy just feels like an extra step at this point.. even If after you pass OKC and get to your facility, the crusty instructor will more than likely say “okay forget everything you learned at OKC.” Am I taking crazy pills here? Is it because politicians want the academy there for their economy bc OKC is a wasteland and has nothing else?

I just needed to fuckin vent. I’ll go back to politely waiting in my COVID free bubble.

 

[ClearanceClarence]

Why even have OKC in the first place? Why not just send everyone through the CIL process, and if you check those boxes, send them to a term/Enroute facility. They have to go through the stages at their respective facility anyway Like basics/map study admin stuff then D side etc etc then Evals which is basically OKC anyway. The Academy just feels like an extra step at this point.. even If after you pass OKC and get to your facility, the crusty instructor will more than likely say “okay forget everything you learned at OKC.” Am I taking crazy pills here? Is it because politicians want the academy there for their economy bc OKC is a wasteland and has nothing else?

I just needed to fuckin vent. I’ll go back to politely waiting in my COVID free bubble.

In many ways, OKC is more of an extended job interview than actually teaching you how to do the job. It’s used to see if people that can’t absorb large amounts of information in a relatively short period of time, if they can regurgitate and apply rules consistently, and if they can handle the pressure of it all. Obviously the people that the agency determines can’t do these things are weeded out. I’m sure for the roughly 50% of people that don’t make it, a temporary assignment to Oklahoma where all your housing and food is paid for is a better situation than uprooting and think you’re moving permanently to a facility only to get the boot after a radar eval.

 

[ONE]

Why even have OKC in the first place? Why not just send everyone through the CIL process, and if you check those boxes, send them to a term/Enroute facility. They have to go through the stages at their respective facility anyway Like basics/map study admin stuff then D side etc etc then Evals which is basically OKC anyway. The Academy just feels like an extra step at this point.. even If after you pass OKC and get to your facility, the crusty instructor will more than likely say “okay forget everything you learned at OKC.” Am I taking crazy pills here? Is it because politicians want the academy there for their economy bc OKC is a wasteland and has nothing else?

I just needed to fuckin vent. I’ll go back to politely waiting in my COVID free bubble.

standardized training. I don't like it either, I don't want the threat of ZNY looming over my head any more than you do

 

[Drewzer]

In many ways, OKC is more of an extended job interview than actually teaching you how to do the job. It’s used to see if people that can’t absorb large amounts of information in a relatively short period of time, if they can regurgitate and apply rules consistently, and if they can handle the pressure of it all. Obviously the people that the agency determines can’t do these things are weeded out. I’m sure for the roughly 50% of people that don’t make it, a temporary assignment to Oklahoma where all your housing and food is paid for is a better situation than uprooting and think you’re moving permanently to a facility only to get the boot after a radar eval.

Then what does the extensive and carefully thought through ATSA measure? Shouldn’t that score reflect if you have the aptitude to do the job? I’d rather be getting per Diem and my housing paid for somewhere else other than OKC wouldn’t you? You can still treat it as probationary/temporary period and still weed out people who can’t do it. Just seems redundant to go to an academy when you’re going to be doing academy things again training at wherever you end up.

 

[ClearanceClarence]

Then what does the extensive and carefully thought through ATSA measure? Shouldn’t that score reflect if you have the aptitude to do the job? I’d rather be getting per Diem and my housing paid for somewhere else other than OKC wouldn’t you? You can still treat it as probationary/temporary period and still weed out people who can’t do it. Just seems redundant to go to an academy when you’re going to be doing academy things again training at wherever you end up.

Welcome to working for the Federal government. You want the job, you gotta jump through the hoops and do it their way, whether it makes sense or not (and many times it does not).

Also, no matter how much research they did on the ATSA, there’s no 3 hour test that could definitively say whether you have the aptitude for the job or not. Only way to find out is by doing it.

 

[Drewzer]

Welcome to working for the Federal government. You want the job, you gotta jump through the hoops and do it their way, whether it makes sense or not (and many times it does not).

Also, no matter how much research they did on the ATSA, there’s no 3 hour test that could definitively say whether you have the aptitude for the job or not. Only way to find out is by doing it.

lol, yeah man. Been working for the feds for years now.

I agree with that I’m also an advocate for getting rid of that test too... shocker I know.

 

[grackfields420]

to become a seal and get your trident insignia, you first have to get meet minimum ASVAB test scores and minimum PST (work out scores). then you've gotta make it through an 8 week buds prep course, and then you gotta make it through buds itself

its reasonable to say that if you cant meet the minimum test score and work out score you probably won't make it through the other 2 sections. each section is kind of like a filter or type of risk management to ensure that a reasonable amount of people at each stage of the pipeline will make it through

i am in no way comparing atc training to buds lol but the theory is the same

think of the atsa as the minimum test score, if your "mental agility" and reading comprehension skills arent good enough to do well on some numbers and logic questions, well then how likely is it that are you gonna be able to absorb a bunch of rules and regulations in faa-speak and keep track of a bunch of stuff at one time efficiently at the academy

if you cant do that at the academy then how likely is it you're gonna get certified at each training phase and not screw up and kill someone during the real deal

its not the best method at all and its crude but it makes enough sense and it works

 

[BigEggplant]

Then what does the extensive and carefully thought through ATSA measure? Shouldn’t that score reflect if you have the aptitude to do the job? I’d rather be getting per Diem and my housing paid for somewhere else other than OKC wouldn’t you? You can still treat it as probationary/temporary period and still weed out people who can’t do it. Just seems redundant to go to an academy when you’re going to be doing academy things again training at wherever you end up.

I think some benefit more than others from OKC, back about 10 years ago they were sending VRA applicants straight to facility upon hire. Apparently managers were not happy with the level of new trainees they were getting and the low checkout rate.

I think the AT-SA measures aptitude, the academy evaluates your ability to learn the way the FAA wants things done. It’s been a while since I was there but I definitely found the experience valuable.

 

[Bart Harley Jarvis]

I see we've reached the point in the bid where people are getting antsy about the next hoops to jump through so we're arguing over the finer points in life like what bands get TOLs, and does MMPI stand for Mississippi Mud Pie Inc.

I'll stir the pot, is a pop tart a calzone? I say yes. Fight me.

 

[Twistedpixel7]

I see we've reached the point in the bid where people are getting antsy about the next hoops to jump through so we're arguing over the finer points in life like what bands get TOLs, and does MMPI stand for Mississippi Mud Pie Inc.

I'll stir the pot, is a pop tart a calzone? I say yes. Fight me.

You sir would make for a fine controller. And yes absolutely, pop tarts are indeed calzones

 

[Bart Harley Jarvis]

You sir would make for a fine controller. And yes absolutely, pop tarts are indeed calzones

Oh do I have a story for you pal...

 

[grackfields420]

Oh do I have a story for you pal...

Yes poptarts are calzones, and hot dogs are sandwiches ?

 

[Twistedpixel7]

Oh do I have a story for you pal...

Sure go ahead.

 

[Mpvr6]

While we are getting rid of the ATSA, MMPI, Drug Test, and the OKC Academy, can we get the ball rolling to get rid of the minimum hours on position to certify? Daddy needs that level 12 CPC pay band to fund a poptart addiction.

 

[Bart Harley Jarvis]

While we are getting rid of the ATSA, MMPI, Drug Test, and the OKC Academy, can we get the ball rolling to get rid of the minimum hours on position to certify? Daddy needs that level 12 CPC pay band to fund a poptart addiction.

Calzone *

 

[Bart Harley Jarvis]

Sure go ahead.

I was a controller, passed academy in 2018. Training when medical issue forced me out. Since been resolved, trying to get back in. Didn't fully CPC so have to do it all over again.