2024 NATCA President Election

[Raise when?]

Fuck you jerkoffs. I’m 5’8”.

Yeah but there’s this

 

[doodii]

Yeah but there’s this

View attachment 8856

I am 205-210 and lift heavily. So I guess I make up for the height.

 

[DADDYSbabyBIRD]

I feel this. 6’3 and same. But personally I like the TRX more. If they made the raptor bronco a V8 I’d happily go that route.


I just want a raise significant enough to be felt on individual paychecks. $50-100 increase on a paycheck is so insignificant to me.

The around 5% raise for me at a level 12 just barely covers the increased cost of groceries and house supplies.

 

[Raise when?]

It’s not pitting controllers against one another. 🙄 It’s an example of a negotiating tool to fight the FAA for better pay based on comparable numbers and facts. People can take anything and hear what they want to hear.

i don’t think it’s the best tactic

The best tactic imo, is flat out emphasizing how much inflation is wrecking this career. I work at a ZAU and newer CPCs can’t afford houses in a nice town. Dude, this is the Midwest we’re talking.

Pay will attract better trainees. We could start washing more of the knuckleheads out that suck.

This is actually a huge issue imo. The FAA has made it harder than ever to wash bad trainees. ZAU itself could easily wash 20% more trainees and the NAS would be safer.

INSTEAD, the FAA has been opting to pay each generation of controllers less and less, devaluing the career to the point of having the attitude that everyone is replaceable. THEN they lecture us constantly with a million briefings on safety and professionalism. I am so fucking god damn tired of all the lecturing about safety; I’ve never had a deal in my career. I care more about safety than the FAA does


And no, the good controllers are not replaceable in a year, or five years. You’re taking decades of knowledge and skill and experience.

I am 205-210 and lift heavily. So I guess I make up for the height.

I try to. I am approaching a 350 bench (short term goal)

I can pull 405 anytime I want, but I have 2 herniated discs in the low back so I generally avoid straight DL now. Still squat at least though 😂

 

[Fat Porrey]

It 100% is pitting. The Union, in many examples, clearly hates non-paying members. I’ve personally seen it.

As they should. All BUEs reap the same benefits from NATCA and only some pay for those benefits. This isn’t a complex concept…

 

[FightingIrish2012]

The Union, in many examples, clearly hates non-paying members. I’ve personally seen it.

So what?

 

[Fat Porrey]

And while many of those are retired controllers, a large portion are also dues paying members waiting to step in to the agency. So does our opinion "matter" the moment we step in the agency.

Then my next question would be, should I then say, "yeah, screw FCTs!" ?


Oh absolutely. I just think it's dumb to, be it inadvertently or not, imply that FCT controllers make too much since some of them make more than 4 to 6s.

Where is he saying that FCT controllers make too much? Maybe give me a time stamp in the video because I’ve watched it several times and can’t find that message anywhere.

 

[RomeoTangoRT]

The around 5% raise for me at a level 12 just barely covers the increased cost of groceries and house supplies.

I’ve contemplated this a bunch but I think a good starting point for our “NATCA negotiated raise” aught to be baseline previous year’s inflation + set percentage.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 2022 CPI was 12.3% less food and energy. THAT’S inflation mitigation.

NATCA needs to represent CONTROLLERS instead of touting a 5% raise that EVERY federal employee gets. 1.6% is bullshit. That averages to $81.36 per paycheck on an “average controller salary.” That doesn’t even cover fuel for that pay period to drive to and from work.

 

[D-Dub]

And no, the good controllers are not replaceable in a year, or five years. You’re taking decades of knowledge and skill and expexperience.

That's an extremely important part of the takeaway for me, even at some of the lower levels that make a decent wage compared to cost of living in their area.

You're not just paying for what we do, you're paying for what we are prepared and know how to do.

Where is he saying that FCT controllers make too much? Maybe give me a time stamp in the video because I’ve watched it several times and can’t find that message anywhere.

Did I say he said that, or did I use the word imply?

Sure you can take it to say he's saying that 4 to 6s just don't make enough, but when you bring in that FCTs make more, it could be implied that you're discrediting their work for the pay they receive.

 

[RomeoTangoRT]

Where is he saying that FCT controllers make too much? Maybe give me a time stamp in the video because I’ve watched it several times and can’t find that message anywhere.

It’s the implication. Everything is subject to interpretation and while you might see it one way, I see it another. It doesn’t make either of us right or wrong.

How I interpreted it is “you have FCT controllers *scoffs* making more than some FAA controllers and they don’t deserve it. There should be no contract tower making more than FAA controllers because they’re second class controllers and only FAA controllers are the real deal.”

Scoff and laugh it off all you want but it’s not the first time I’ve personally felt that mindset being cast towards me.

 

[doodii]

I try to. I am approaching a 350 bench (short term goal)

I can pull 405 anytime I want, but I have 2 herniated discs in the low back so I generally avoid straight DL now. Still squat at least though 😂

Once I got 525 on deads, I stopped powerlifting. That was maybe 2016. My L5 isn’t happy. Never took care of myself then.

As they should. All BUEs reap the same benefits from NATCA and only some pay for those benefits. This isn’t a complex concept…

Don’t hate the player, hate the game. If they didn’t want non members reaping benefits, they would’ve fought against it.

 

[ajmezz]

It’s the implication. Everything is subject to interpretation and while you might see it one way, I see it another. It doesn’t make either of us right or wrong.

How I interpreted it is “you have FCT controllers *scoffs* making more than some FAA controllers and they don’t deserve it. There should be no contract tower making more than FAA controllers because they’re second class controllers and only FAA controllers are the real deal.”

Scoff and laugh it off all you want but it’s not the first time I’ve personally felt that mindset being cast towards me.

I’ve seen the same sentiment towards low level facilities in the faa as well so they might as well be contracted out too.

 

[AB19]

i don’t think it’s the best tactic

The best tactic imo, is flat out emphasizing how much inflation is wrecking this career. I work at a ZAU and newer CPCs can’t afford houses in a nice town. Dude, this is the Midwest we’re talking.

Pay will attract better trainees. We could start washing more of the knuckleheads out that suck.

This is actually a huge issue imo. The FAA has made it harder than ever to wash bad trainees. ZAU itself could easily wash 20% more trainees and the NAS would be safer.

INSTEAD, the FAA has been opting to pay each generation of controllers less and less, devaluing the career to the point of having the attitude that everyone is replaceable. THEN they lecture us constantly with a million briefings on safety and professionalism. I am so fucking god damn tired of all the lecturing about safety; I’ve never had a deal in my career. I care more about safety than the FAA does


And no, the good controllers are not replaceable in a year, or five years. You’re taking decades of knowledge and skill and experience.

Housing here is insane

 

[RomeoTangoRT]

I’ve seen the same sentiment towards low level facilities in the faa as well so they might as well be contracted out too.

They act like it helps the staffing issue. I haven’t been to an FCT that’s fully staffed for longer than 25% of my time there 😂 but out of sight out of mind. The only difference is FCT companies are for profit so they don’t give a fuck if they’re staffed or not. I’ve seen some numbers thrown around saying FCT companies get $200 per hour per controller. So that’s $416,000 a year per slot. I’ve averaged in the ballpark of $120k each of the last 5 years with extensive OT. So FCTs are making nearly $300k on my head AND they’re understaffed so for every missing body, that’s $416k in their pocket. FCT controllers are getting robbed blind.

 

[Fat Porrey]

Don’t hate the player, hate the game. If they didn’t want non members reaping benefits, they would’ve fought against it.

But that’d illegal. Is this really a tough concept?

Right to fair representation | National Labor Relations Board

You have a right to be represented by your union fairly, in good faith, and without discrimination.

www.nlrb.gov

 

[D-Dub]

They act like it helps the staffing issue. I haven’t been to an FCT that’s fully staffed for longer than 25% of my time there 😂 but out of sight out of mind. The only difference is FCT companies are for profit so they don’t give a fuck if they’re staffed or not. I’ve seen some numbers thrown around saying FCT companies get $200 per hour per controller. So that’s $416,000 a year per slot. I’ve averaged in the ballpark of $120k each of the last 5 years with extensive OT. So FCTs are making nearly $300k on my head AND they’re understaffed so for every missing body, that’s $416k in their pocket. FCT controllers are getting robbed blind.

Also, FCTs fully staffed definition is usually no more than 6 controllers including the ATM. I doubt the FAA would be cool with people having to piss in bottles or shit in trash cans because they don't have relief.

Our servicing approach will rotate between 3 to 4 controllers before I go on my first(only) break.

 

[RomeoTangoRT]

Also, FCTs fully staffed definition is usually no more than 6 controllers including the ATM. I doubt the FAA would be cool with people having to piss in bottles or shit in trash cans because they don't have relief.

Our servicing approach will rotate between 3 to 4 controllers before I go on my first(only) break.

We were slotted for 10 at HWO, had 6, negligible difference in annual traffic count with FLL next door who was 24 hours and had 24 CPCs. (And they made more working 40hrs than we did working 60s)

Also, FCTs fully staffed definition is usually no more than 6 controllers including the ATM. I doubt the FAA would be cool with people having to piss in bottles or shit in trash cans because they don't have relief.

Our servicing approach will rotate between 3 to 4 controllers before I go on my first(only) break.

I’ve also brought this up within our own FCT union channels given I’m our facrep. The whole lack of break rotation and relief. There are FCTs out there who are fully staffed with 3 bodies and work scheduled 2 man days on the weekend. Meaning one person on position for 8 hours straight, each. No break.

 

[D-Dub]

We were slotted for 10 at HWO, had 6, negligible difference in annual traffic count with FLL next door who was 24 hours and had 24 CPCs. (And they made more working 40hrs than we did working 60s)

I remember you mentioning that in another thread. Didn't the FAA come out to see how yall operated as well?

 

[RomeoTangoRT]

I remember you mentioning that in another thread. Didn't the FAA come out to see how yall operated as well?

Yeah which is how we ended up with 10 slots. Just more funding for the FCTs who know they can’t staff it.

 

[D-Dub]

Yeah which is how we ended up with 10 slots. Just more funding for the FCTs who know they can’t staff it.

Yeah, not many people wanting to work HWO ops for that pay, much less at all when they're using FCT as a stepping stone or retirement.