How do gate swaps increase complexity at a TRACON? Asking as a center controller
2024 NATCA President Election
- Thread starter FightingIrish2012
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AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise
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None of you have worked real traffic if you didn’t work pre 9/11 Traffic. Now, let’s get back to the subject on hand: why the fuck haven’t Santa and Mick brought up our pay until they are both running for an election? Is there any justification other than they want to be elected?
Foppery&Whim
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Because they would have to get a real job?
pedaNTIc
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That and only that.
And look at the past three years as a gauge in ability to deliver on anything.
GroundClutter
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Or you know, your training was delayed due to CPDLC then WhuanFlu and you go to the bottom of the band each time you get certified on your way to CPC.
Keeping two to three years of step increases as you compound off in to retirement sure would've been nice.
32andBelow
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They need to put the steps into lanes so when you change lanes you don’t lose any steps. A step would be your 1.6 your facility would be your lane.
Dontbotherme
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Level and pay range:
12: 190-220K
11: 180-210K
10: 170-200K
9: 157.5-187.5K
8: 145-175K
7: 132.5-162.5K
6: 120-150K
5: 107.5-137.5K
4: 95-125K
Just like the red book provided, give a 3% or the bottom of the pay band, whichever is greater over the next three years. Eliminate the double bump, for transfers, that existed for under the red book. You still get half on the go and the other half when you certify.
New Example:
Transfer from a level 7 to a level 12
Year 1 of new book-
132.5K to 161.25K (includes half on the go between current pay and bottom of 12 band)
Year 2 of new book-
161.25K to 166.09K (still in training so you get 3%)
Year 3 of new book-
166.09K to 190K (certification achieved so you get bottom of 12 band)
Renegotiate CIP and tie it to some inflation calculator. For this example, let’s just use CPI. From 2016 until 2023, CIP has stayed at $30M. If it was increased yearly based on CPI data, that same amount would now be $38.5M. It would provide for more CIP funds to be disbursed appropriately to understaffed facilities, its original purpose, not to bastardize COLA.
Change NCEPT to a 4 level cap on transfers.
Everyone gets a pay raise, CIP is increased to provide more funds to address needs, and NCEPT is altered to address staffing at mid level facilities who can then potentially transfer out to higher level facilities.
Actually go in front of the media and Congress and tell them the truth about the Agency. Stop with this whole everything is fine approach. It’s time to step on some toes to force the Agency to staff facilities.
12: 190-220K
11: 180-210K
10: 170-200K
9: 157.5-187.5K
8: 145-175K
7: 132.5-162.5K
6: 120-150K
5: 107.5-137.5K
4: 95-125K
Just like the red book provided, give a 3% or the bottom of the pay band, whichever is greater over the next three years. Eliminate the double bump, for transfers, that existed for under the red book. You still get half on the go and the other half when you certify.
New Example:
Transfer from a level 7 to a level 12
Year 1 of new book-
132.5K to 161.25K (includes half on the go between current pay and bottom of 12 band)
Year 2 of new book-
161.25K to 166.09K (still in training so you get 3%)
Year 3 of new book-
166.09K to 190K (certification achieved so you get bottom of 12 band)
Renegotiate CIP and tie it to some inflation calculator. For this example, let’s just use CPI. From 2016 until 2023, CIP has stayed at $30M. If it was increased yearly based on CPI data, that same amount would now be $38.5M. It would provide for more CIP funds to be disbursed appropriately to understaffed facilities, its original purpose, not to bastardize COLA.
Change NCEPT to a 4 level cap on transfers.
Everyone gets a pay raise, CIP is increased to provide more funds to address needs, and NCEPT is altered to address staffing at mid level facilities who can then potentially transfer out to higher level facilities.
Actually go in front of the media and Congress and tell them the truth about the Agency. Stop with this whole everything is fine approach. It’s time to step on some toes to force the Agency to staff facilities.
Last paragraph hits hard
Mike Kilo
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Right now we keep the 1.6% raise after certifying, so that 3% they got year 2 should go on top of the bottom of the band as well. Just like we should keep all of those 1.6 raises as we change bands, even if I go to a 12 from a 7. It would be easy for the FAA to track that dollar amount.
CaptainObvious
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My 1.6 got eaten in training. When you certify should move to band plus 1.6, 3.2, whatever. Especially since I got paused halfway through my last two sectors during Covid. So the 1.6 in 2020 just evaporated
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Yeah but if you don't pay it you won't be included on.lunch runs or something
Mike Kilo
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When you are in the D bands and an initial training it could be and shouldn’t be. But when you transfer your 50% on cert goes on top of your 1.6%. I’ve never transferred as a CPC and gone to the base without being slightly above it due to this.
CaptainObvious
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I had three years total of 1.6 as a CPCIT, went to bottom of band when I certified
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You might wanna look into that. If you want what you deserve. The half on the go is the exact same amount you should get when you certify. The 1.6% you get each year makes it so your slightly above the band.
It doesn’t get eaten for ERRs. It’s only a temp raise for hardships and swaps if you come from below the band.
Half on the go, other half upon cert is not the same as bottom of band upon cert.
Mike Kilo
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As others said, I would look into it. When you figure your 50% on the go consider it a dollar amount. Then you should get the same dollar amount on cert.
I guess maybe if the band moved up enough in January you could possibly have gone straight to the bottom of the band. That should definitely be fixed so we keep all our “step” raises.
I’m going to give you all the answer on cip someone couldn’t give me even after saying that I should pack a lunch and let him school me.
The original distribution of CIP was allocated based on the runzheimer index. It’s basically a cost of living adjustment. It wasn’t originally implemented for “hard to staff” facilities.
If they could increase the amount of the CIP pool ,my belief is they should re -run the runzheimer index and allocate appropriately.
Maybe the consensus is just give it to hard to staff facilities. I don’t think it should be some from the original runzheimer and some hard to staff. Make it one or the other and transparent. Hard to argue facts. I don’t like the wishy washy middle ground we are in.
The original distribution of CIP was allocated based on the runzheimer index. It’s basically a cost of living adjustment. It wasn’t originally implemented for “hard to staff” facilities.
If they could increase the amount of the CIP pool ,my belief is they should re -run the runzheimer index and allocate appropriately.
Maybe the consensus is just give it to hard to staff facilities. I don’t think it should be some from the original runzheimer and some hard to staff. Make it one or the other and transparent. Hard to argue facts. I don’t like the wishy washy middle ground we are in.
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bravounite33
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My counter to giving it to "hard to staff" facilities is that eventually, those facilities will get staffed and then what? I don't love the idea of telling people here's 10% CIP since you're 60% staffed but when they get up to 85%, congrats on getting staffed, but now you lose your 10% CIP bonus...
Agree
FightingIrish2012
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Can we get this back on the front page and stop talking about the AUS shit? It’s been 24 hours and no discussion of pay, that needs to be the prime topic all day, everyday #razewen?
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