Pushed to the brink? Another NYT article rehashes all the problems that haven't changed since before Reagan and PATCO

ATCNOMAD said:
Don't be mad at us ex military folks because we already had real world and real life experiences coming into the agency while you still had your thumb up your a$$. Your problem not mine. Cry more.
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Dude, as ex military, the military is as far from real world as you can get. It’s its own world and it isn’t anything like civvy real world. Stateside Air Force anyway we were fucking coddled.
 
DankVectorz said:
Working hard doesn’t equal real world experience. It just means you were the class clown and now you’re in the army.
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The military teaches a ton of real world experiences. Just because you were in the chill force and didn't experience how the real military workers is your problem. And it's hard to be the Clown when I make more money than almost everyone I went to school with with zero student loan debt. The FAA even gave me a 20k bonus for having a CTO. If that's a class clown more people should sign up lol.
 
ATCNOMAD said:
The military teaches a ton of real world experiences. Just because you were in the chill force and didn't experience how the real military workers is your problem. And it's hard to be the Clown when I make more money than almost everyone I went to school with with zero student loan debt. The FAA even gave me a 20k bonus for having a CTO. If that's a class clown more people should sign up lol.
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I did real world before the military, it’s what I ran away from by enlisting. Dropped out of college, went to trade school, turned wrenches for a few years, sat in a cubicle for an insurance company and said fuck this shit.
 
DankVectorz said:
I did real world before the military, it’s what I ran away from by enlisting. Dropped out of college, went to trade school, turned wrenches for a few years, sat in a cubicle for an insurance company and said fuck this shit.
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I don't disagree. My wife works in the "real world." It's honestly what you do. Her job seems worse than the FAA but but much better than the military. I meet people everyday with great "real world" jobs that wouldn't last 5 min in the US Army. At least not the early 2000s US Army. 9/11 while I was in boot. If it's different now o wouldn't know.
 
ATCNOMAD said:
I don't disagree. My wife works in the "real world." It's honestly what you do. Her job seems worse than the FAA but but much better than the military. I meet people everyday with great "real world" jobs that wouldn't last 5 min in the US Army. At least not the early 2000s US Army. 9/11 while I was in boot. If it's different now o wouldn't know.
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I mean I’ve met plenty of military people who can’t hack the civilian world. Need the structure the military provides they can’t get outside.
 
ATCNOMAD said:
Don't be mad at us ex military folks because we already had real world and real life experiences coming into the agency while you still had your thumb up your a$$. Your problem not mine. Cry more.
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5yrs military controlling is damn near the same as a CTI degree I said what I said. Don’t get me wrong thank you for your service but I’ve seen the product from OTS CTI and prior military and unless you came from a busier base it’s all about the same lol.
 
DankVectorz said:
I mean I’ve met plenty of military people who can’t hack the civilian world. Need the structure the military provides they can’t get outside. In my opinion people like that choose the military because life structure provided is better to them they would make it as a civilian if they really wanted to. Law enforcement boarder patrol fire fighters are all jobs with provided structure uniforms ext...
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In my opinion people like that choose the military because life structure provided is better to them they would make it as a civilian if they really wanted to. Law enforcement boarder patrol fire fighters are all jobs with provided structure uniforms ext...
DankVectorz said:
I mean I’ve met plenty of military people who can’t hack the civilian world. Need the structure the military provides they can’t get outside.
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32andBelow said:
This take has always been kinda bogus cus most of the CTI degrees were just aviation management/business degrees with a focus for? It’s an extremely long process that required
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AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise said:
Don’t hijack this thread. Emily Steele highlighted real issues in our profession and brought them into the public eye. In the meantime, Our union seems hellbent on doing nothing to improve our quality of life and compensation. We really need our national to do something big soon.
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Agreed. Emily Steele, please continue to highlight the FAA’s shortcomings and gain further knowledge of the inept union that has not been representing controllers as a union should under these working conditions. As you can see the union had to downplay this alarming accurate article because they know they have become complicit in getting to this point. They co-sign training on how to properly manage fatigue, use caffeine appropriately, sleep etc it’s down right sickening every time I get assigned this fatigue training.
 
DankVectorz said:
I mean I’ve met plenty of military people who can’t hack the civilian world. Need the structure the military provides they can’t get outside. In my opinion people like that choose the military because life structure provided is better to them they would make it as a civilian if they really wanted to. Law enforcement boarder patrol fire fighters are all jobs with provided structure uniforms ext...
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BDUB said:
5yrs military controlling is damn near the same as a CTI degree I said what I said. Don’t get me wrong thank you for your service but I’ve seen the product from OTS CTI and prior military and unless you came from a busier base it’s all about the same lol.
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ATC wise yea about the same. But overall as a person living in the real world you are much more prepared for the real world and the workforce coming out the military than coming from college or living with mom and dad with a minimum wage job

AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise said:
Don’t hijack this thread. Emily Steele highlighted real issues in our profession and brought them into the public eye. In the meantime, Our union seems hellbent on doing nothing to improve our quality of life and compensation. We really need our national to do something big soon.
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I'm sorry and it's my fault the thread was starting to get hijacked. We definitely need to get back to the original point. My apologies. I will keep my comments going further on topic
 
ATCNOMAD said:
ATC wise yea about the same. But overall as a person living in the real world you are much more prepared for the real world and the workforce coming out the military than coming from college or living with mom and dad with a minimum wage job


I'm sorry and it's my fault the thread was starting to get hijacked. We definitely need to get back to the original point. My apologies. I will keep my comments going further on topic
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In your defense, I don’t know what else there is to say. There seems to be a disconnect between our national union and the members who are in the control room every day and that email just proves it. I’ll admit I’m a bit ignorant when it comes to politics and the legislative process of improving QOL for us. That being said, I would think our union would try its best to capitalize on the SRT report and this NYT Article. Their Emails are laser focused on CRWG and improved staffing. The problem is we all know staffing won’t be improved in the short term. In the meantime, NATCA should be screaming from the mountain top to improve compensation for its employees who are working in less than ideal staffing. I love the idea of 200% OT and 25% weekend pay, specifically. Take this with a grain of salt because I’m an idiot who knows nothing.
 
AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise said:
The problem is we all know staffing won’t be improved in the short term.
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This is what makes me cynical about all this weeping and gnashing of teeth shit. The first response to staffing woes is increasing TOP. TOP can only move so much but the FAA is too dumb to realize that so they raid the CPC ranks for more supes to increase oversight, which just makes the staffing problems worse. Eventually it will be even more impossible to wash people. And they still can go nuclear option on ERRs. Not to mention the hostile negotiating environment this creates for the union. The FAA is pressed about staffing and we think we are going to get more favorable working conditions?

But I don't know if you get to the long term solution (congress coming up off some money) without some short term pain.
 

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