Four-day workweek

[steakvendor]

Do controllers working four 10-hour days get 10 hours of holiday pay on holidays? Do they get ten hours of holiday leave as well?
What about sunday pay?

 

[DowntownTG]

Yes to all. The 10-hrs of holiday pay and 10-hrs of Sunday pay were certainly missed when I went back to 8-hr days.

 

[steakvendor]

Yes to all. The 10-hrs of holiday pay and 10-hrs of Sunday pay were certainly missed when I went back to 8-hr days.

Are there any downsides to four 10s? This is the first year my facility will be bidding on those days and it seems like there are no downsides aside from having to burn an extra 2 hours of leave to take a whole day off.

 

[DankVectorz]

Yes to all. The 10-hrs of holiday pay and 10-hrs of Sunday pay were certainly missed when I went back to 8-hr days.

What? You don’t get 10 hours of holiday pay. Is this a troll post? I just worked a 10 hour day and am tired.

 

[MJ]

Here's what OPM says:

Spoiler: Leave

Standard (40-Hour/5-Day Week) Work Schedules. On a holiday, employees under a standard work schedule are generally excused from 8 hours of nonovertime work, which are considered part of the 40-hour basic workweek.

Flexible Work Schedules. On a holiday, employees under flexible work schedules are credited with 8 hours towards their 80-hour basic work requirement for the pay period. Employees under flexible work schedules are credited with 8 holiday hours even if they would otherwise work more hours on that day. In the event the President issues an Executive order granting a "half-day" holiday, a full-time employee on a flexible work schedule is credited with half the number of hours he or she was scheduled to work, not to exceed 4 hours. (See 5 U.S.C. 6124 and the definition of "basic work requirement" in 5 U.S.C. 6121(3).)

Compressed Work Schedules. On a holiday, employees under compressed work schedules are generally excused from all of the nonovertime hours they would otherwise work on that day and which apply to their "basic work requirement." For example, if a holiday falls on a 9- or 10-hour basic workday, the employee's holiday is 9 or 10 hours, respectively. In the event the President issues an Executive order granting a "half-day" holiday, a full-time employee on a compressed work schedule is entitled to basic pay for half the number of hours he or she would otherwise work on that day. (See 5 CFR 610.406(a).)

Spoiler: Pay

Standard (40-Hour/5 Day Week) Work Schedules. Employees are entitled to holiday premium pay if they are required to work on a holiday during their regularly scheduled nonovertime basic tours of duty, not to exceed 8 hours.

Flexible Work Schedules. Employees under flexible work schedules are entitled to holiday premium pay if they are required to work during the hours of their "basic work requirement" (i.e., nonovertime hours) on that day, not to exceed 8 hours. In the event the President issues an Executive order granting a "half-day" holiday, part-time employees on a flexible work schedule are entitled to holiday premium pay if they are required to work during the last half of their "basic work requirement" (i.e., nonovertime hours) on that day, not to exceed 4 hours.

Compressed Work Schedules. Employees under compressed work schedules are entitled to holiday premium pay if they are required to work during their "basic work requirement" on that day. The number of hours of holiday premium pay may not exceed the hours in an employee's compressed work schedule for that day (e.g., 8, 9, or 10 nonovertime hours). (See 5 CFR 610.407.) In the event the President issues an Executive order granting a "half-day" holiday, part-time employees on a compressed work schedule are entitled to holiday premium pay if they are required to work during the last half of their "basic work requirement" (i.e., nonovertime hours) on that day.

Downtown and Dank are both right, it just depends on which work schedule you are on. All our lines were flex, but I assume if you have scheduled 4-10s (compressed) you would be on that. That column on cru-art actually means something 🙂

 

[steakvendor]

So just to be clear, on a flex schedule, we only get 8 hours of both holiday and sunday pay? My facrep seems to be under the impression that the slate book wording says we get 10 hours of both.

 

[MJ]

So just to be clear, on a flex schedule, we only get 8 hours of both holiday and sunday pay? My facrep seems to be under the impression that the slate book wording says we get 10 hours of both.

Article 32 bud. It basically restates what the OPM rules are. It depends on what schedule type you are assigned to. It’s not the amount of hours you work per se, because you could be on a flex and work 9 or 10 hr shifts. In which case you would only be entitled to 8 hrs holiday pay. If you volunteered in writing (CBA requirement) and are assigned to take a compressed work schedule then you get the 9/10 hrs.

 

[DankVectorz]

It would be nice if those of us on mandatory 6 days with scheduled 10 hour days would get 10 hours of holiday pay. And wait, there are facilities where you only have to work 4 days?!!?

 

[MJ]

It would be nice if those of us on mandatory 6 days with scheduled 10 hour days would get 10 hours of holiday pay. And wait, there are facilities where you only have to work 4 days?!!?

Are they 8 hr days with 2 hrs OT? I can't dig into it at the moment, but I'm nearly positive OT requires payment of all premium pays regardless of schedule type.

 

[DankVectorz]

Are they 8 hr days with 2 hrs OT? I can't dig into it at the moment, but I'm nearly positive OT requires payment of all premium pays regardless of schedule type.

8 hour days with 2 hours OT either on the front or back

 

[MJ]

So here's the OPM guidance:
(emphasis added)

Overtime on Holidays
Overtime Work on a Holiday
Standard (40-Hour/5-Day Week) Work Schedules. Overtime work on a holiday is work in excess of 8 hours in a day or 40 hours in a week. This also applies to part-time employees.
Flexible Work Schedules. Overtime work on a holiday for employees under flexible work schedules is work in excess of 8 hours in a day or 40 hours in a week that is officially ordered in advance. (See 5 U.S.C. 6121(6).)
Compressed Work Schedules. Overtime work on a holiday for an employee under a compressed work schedule is hours of work in excess of the employee's compressed work schedule (e.g., 8-, 9-, or 10-hour "basic work requirement") on that day. (See 5 U.S.C. 6121(7).)
Holiday hours, hours of paid leave, use of accrued compensatory time off or credit hours, and hours of excused absence with pay are credited as hours of work towards the overtime pay standards. For example, these hours are credited when determining whether an employee has worked in excess of 8 hours in a day or 40 hours in a week under a standard or flexible work schedule. (See 5 CFR 550.112(c) and 5 CFR 551.401(b).)
Employees are not excused from overtime work on a holiday because of the holiday.
Overtime Pay On a Holiday
Employees are entitled to overtime pay, or compensatory time off, when applicable, if the agency requires overtime work on a holiday.
Overtime work must generally be ordered or approved. However, employees who are covered by the overtime pay provisions of the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938, as amended (FLSA), also are entitled to overtime pay if overtime work is "suffered or permitted" by a supervisor. One exception is that no "suffered and permitted" hours of work can be credited to employees under flexible work schedules.
Overtime work does not include credit hours worked voluntarily (earned) under a flexible work schedule. (See 5 U.S.C. 6121(6).)

And article 28 s3 of the CBA restates that. Holiday pay can only be paid for basic work hours, and not overtime hours. Pretty lousy

 

[Dontbotherme]

The other BS one is that 8 hour guys only get 8 hours of holiday pay even though they work a morning and mid on a holiday. Example: 0545-1345 (8 hours holiday pay) and 2215-0615 (no holiday pay). We shouldn’t be screwed out of that 1+45 of holiday pay.

 

[170tovocus]

The other BS one is that 8 hour guys only get 8 hours of holiday pay even though they work a morning and mid on a holiday. Example: 0545-1345 (8 hours holiday pay) and 2215-0615 (no holiday pay). We shouldn’t be screwed out of that 1+45 of holiday pay.

What would you get if you only worked the mid that day? Would you just get the 1:45 OT, or the full 8?

 

[Dontbotherme]

What would you get if you only worked the mid that day? Would you just get the 1:45 OT, or the full 8?

It would be your day in lieu where you would get the 8 hours of holiday pay plus you should get the 1+45 for actually being assigned a shift on the holiday. It makes zero sense that a 10 hour assigned guy gets 10 hours of holiday pay, but the person working more than 8 hours doesn’t get more holiday pay.

 

[MJ]

Yeah it should simply be if you're working you're paid. Remember this next time the CBA is up for negotiation

 

[DowntownTG]

I had 4-10's but split RDO's a few years ago. Mon/Tues/Fri were my RDO's We got 10-hrs of holiday and 10-hrs of Sunday differential.

The only downside was with the split RDO's the middle RDO (Fri in my case) felt very short. We were supposed to be scheduled 1330, 1130, RDO, 7, 6, RDO/RDO. But after the annual leave was bid, 95% of my weeks that year were 1330, 1330, RDO, 6, 6, RDO, RDO. So working til 1130pm, having an RDO and then needing to be at work at 6am the day after the RDO was tough on sleep for that RDO.

Also as a negative in general; not everyone on each crew had 4 10's. The 8-hr guys on each line had a lot more double and triple mid's due to all the 10-hr guys not doing mid's for the entire year.

 

[32andBelow]

T

I had 4-10's but split RDO's a few years ago. Mon/Tues/Fri were my RDO's We got 10-hrs of holiday and 10-hrs of Sunday differential.

The only downside was with the split RDO's the middle RDO (Fri in my case) felt very short. We were supposed to be scheduled 1330, 1130, RDO, 7, 6, RDO/RDO. But after the annual leave was bid, 95% of my weeks that year were 1330, 1330, RDO, 6, 6, RDO, RDO. So working til 1130pm, having an RDO and then needing to be at work at 6am the day after the RDO was tough on sleep for that RDO.

Also as a negative in general; not everyone on each crew had 4 10's. The 8-hr guys on each line had a lot more double and triple mid's due to all the 10-hr guys not doing mid's for the entire year.

that just sounds crazy! I’d just want to work 5 8s st that point

 

[DankVectorz]

Oh no. One of your 3 days off felt short.

 

[ATC_av8er]

Are there any downsides to four 10s? This is the first year my facility will be bidding on those days and it seems like there are no downsides aside from having to burn an extra 2 hours of leave to take a whole day off.

You can be called in for 2 days of OT.