N90 (Newark Area) to PHL FOIA's

[twn]

Spicy spicy

 

[I.DO.VEHCTAHS]

Speaking as one of those trainees who washed on purpose, I disagree with that, most of the people washing in the labs now are doing it on purpose because of the NEST lists. But closing that “loophole” would be bad for controllers and NATCA, even though it would benefit N90. The con’s of working/living there outweigh the pro’s for people who have arrived the last 3-4 years. Cost of living is insane, taxes are insane, commutes are insane unless you want to live in a shithole house in a shithole town. The culture of the facility isn’t great, but it’s not as bad as everyone else in the FAA thinks it is. The biggest hurdle (for facility staffing) is that the only people that want to certify there are people who grew up there from my point of view. The only incentive to stay would be bringing back the 25% CIP in a permanent capacity or something else along those lines, or eventually moving the entire facility upstate or somewhere where its at least moderately affordable to live. You shouldn’t have to work a shit ton of OT and make $275k to be able to afford a small 3bd/2ba house in an ok town. Not to mention the 6 day weeks, 10ish hour days, and commutes are bad for marriages, families, and raising kids. People are choosing their personal lives over their jobs, which is something that should be applauded not admonished. I liked a lot of people there, especially in my sector, but that place is a misery factory if you’ve been there a long time.

Oh I completely agree…I’d wash on purpose too if I knew about these dream NEST lists they’re getting. The only thing that will ever fix this place is money and/or new hires who do not have the option of 100 other facilities if they’re unsuccessful.

I don’t think anyone is admonishing anyone. Just don’t waste our time. If you’re going to waste our time and take the slot that could have been a local hire or someone who actually wants to be here…yep, nothing to say to you. You’re keeping the system broken.

And for context…I am not a local.

 

[Move78]

Oh I completely agree…I’d wash on purpose too if I knew about these dream NEST lists they’re getting. The only thing that will ever fix this place is money and/or new hires who do not have the option of 100 other facilities if they’re unsuccessful.

I don’t think anyone is admonishing anyone. Just don’t waste our time. If you’re going to waste our time and take the slot that could have been a local hire or someone who actually wants to be here…yep, nothing to say to you. You’re keeping the system broken.

And for context…I am not a local.

If you do vectahs you’re local enough

 

[Phillyman2633]

Regardless of any preconceived attitudes you may have towards N90 as a facility or any personal enmity you have against the people who work there (anyone who works in an underlying or adjacent facility will attest that assholes abound), you should be appalled and disgusted by National's lack of representation of N90 controllers.

The union is obligated to negotiate on behalf of it's members, and the fact that the only union leadership involved in the negotiations were Paul, Trish, Dean, and 3 NATCA lawyers is abhorrent. At no point were the FacReps of N90 or PHL consulted prior to the signing of the initial MOU between NATCA national and the FAA. Members weren't consulted on . The union and FAA have workgroups on fucking EVERYTHING...wake turbulence, stripless towers, etc... so the fact that nobody else was brought into the project would certainly indicate to me that upper union wanted to maintain utmost secrecy because they wanted to leverage their complicity and cooperation in this project against another project somewhere else.

The FAA has dumped so much money into this project that they're determined to ram it down our throats and get it across the finish line at all costs because of the sheer amount of money that has been poured into the project. Tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars have been spent on this project to this point, and so there are most certainly people in the ATO and other organizations who are making this their culminating career project...whether the project happens is going to make or break a lot of careers. The FAA can't let this project fail because the amount of time, money, and man hours poured into the project would certainly precipitate a Congressional inquiry, so they are going to fight this lawsuit to the death to ensure that nothing confidential is released and the project reaches completion.

Between the contract extension, the NCEPT, and now this project, you are being bent over a hard park bench and fucking railroaded by your national leadership. We should all be appalled by this project and should be fucking roasting national to find out what the fuck is going on.

 

[twn]

Regardless of any preconceived attitudes you may have towards N90 as a facility or any personal enmity you have against the people who work there (anyone who works in an underlying or adjacent facility will attest that assholes abound), you should be appalled and disgusted by National's lack of representation of N90 controllers.

The union is obligated to negotiate on behalf of it's members, and the fact that the only union leadership involved in the negotiations were Paul, Trish, Dean, and 3 NATCA lawyers is abhorrent. At no point were the FacReps of N90 or PHL consulted prior to the signing of the initial MOU between NATCA national and the FAA. Members weren't consulted on . The union and FAA have workgroups on fucking EVERYTHING...wake turbulence, stripless towers, etc... so the fact that nobody else was brought into the project would certainly indicate to me that upper union wanted to maintain utmost secrecy because they wanted to leverage their complicity and cooperation in this project against another project somewhere else.

The FAA has dumped so much money into this project that they're determined to ram it down our throats and get it across the finish line at all costs because of the sheer amount of money that has been poured into the project. Tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars have been spent on this project to this point, and so there are most certainly people in the ATO and other organizations who are making this their culminating career project...whether the project happens is going to make or break a lot of careers. The FAA can't let this project fail because the amount of time, money, and man hours poured into the project would certainly precipitate a Congressional inquiry, so they are going to fight this lawsuit to the death to ensure that nothing confidential is released and the project reaches completion.

Between the contract extension, the NCEPT, and now this project, you are being bent over a hard park bench and fucking railroaded by your national leadership. We should all be appalled by this project and should be fucking roasting national to find out what the fuck is going on.

Preach.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, National doesn't care about us. They have become bigger than us, they are self serving. The FAA and NATCA have become one through collaboration.

It's time for serious change or the end of our union is near.

 

[FightingIrish2012]

Regardless of any preconceived attitudes you may have towards N90 as a facility or any personal enmity you have against the people who work there (anyone who works in an underlying or adjacent facility will attest that assholes abound), you should be appalled and disgusted by National's lack of representation of N90 controllers.

The union is obligated to negotiate on behalf of it's members, and the fact that the only union leadership involved in the negotiations were Paul, Trish, Dean, and 3 NATCA lawyers is abhorrent. At no point were the FacReps of N90 or PHL consulted prior to the signing of the initial MOU between NATCA national and the FAA. Members weren't consulted on . The union and FAA have workgroups on fucking EVERYTHING...wake turbulence, stripless towers, etc... so the fact that nobody else was brought into the project would certainly indicate to me that upper union wanted to maintain utmost secrecy because they wanted to leverage their complicity and cooperation in this project against another project somewhere else.

The FAA has dumped so much money into this project that they're determined to ram it down our throats and get it across the finish line at all costs because of the sheer amount of money that has been poured into the project. Tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars have been spent on this project to this point, and so there are most certainly people in the ATO and other organizations who are making this their culminating career project...whether the project happens is going to make or break a lot of careers. The FAA can't let this project fail because the amount of time, money, and man hours poured into the project would certainly precipitate a Congressional inquiry, so they are going to fight this lawsuit to the death to ensure that nothing confidential is released and the project reaches completion.

Between the contract extension, the NCEPT, and now this project, you are being bent over a hard park bench and fucking railroaded by your national leadership. We should all be appalled by this project and should be fucking roasting national to find out what the fuck is going on.

Dean would never have done that he worked at N90 and knows all those controllers there.

 

[RadarRick]

Preach.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, National doesn't care about us. They have become bigger than us, they are self serving. The FAA and NATCA have become one through collaboration.

It's time for serious change or the end of our union is near.

Look at the difference in the way the Pilot Unions run v NATCA. They for the most part send all the shit they’re negotiating on out to their members, the Reps for each hub disseminate information on a much more frequent basis than what we get, and the pilots generally get a vote Yes or No on contract extensions or modifications.


NATCA does all of that shit behind your back, randomly extends a contract that does nothing to address the horrible work rules and QOL of controllers stuck working 6 days a week, has made it almost impossible for a large chunk of the work force to ever transfer, and if you voice any displeasure you get blacklisted as a non loyal member who just doesn’t understand how it works.

It’s not surprising to me that they’ve done something shady w the N90 move, because as much as I’m supportive of labor and union rights, NATCA is a terrible union. And I’m a dues paying member.

 

[natca.gov]

Regardless of any preconceived attitudes you may have towards N90 as a facility or any personal enmity you have against the people who work there (anyone who works in an underlying or adjacent facility will attest that assholes abound), you should be appalled and disgusted by National's lack of representation of N90 controllers.

The union is obligated to negotiate on behalf of it's members, and the fact that the only union leadership involved in the negotiations were Paul, Trish, Dean, and 3 NATCA lawyers is abhorrent. At no point were the FacReps of N90 or PHL consulted prior to the signing of the initial MOU between NATCA national and the FAA. Members weren't consulted on . The union and FAA have workgroups on fucking EVERYTHING...wake turbulence, stripless towers, etc... so the fact that nobody else was brought into the project would certainly indicate to me that upper union wanted to maintain utmost secrecy because they wanted to leverage their complicity and cooperation in this project against another project somewhere else.

The FAA has dumped so much money into this project that they're determined to ram it down our throats and get it across the finish line at all costs because of the sheer amount of money that has been poured into the project. Tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars have been spent on this project to this point, and so there are most certainly people in the ATO and other organizations who are making this their culminating career project...whether the project happens is going to make or break a lot of careers. The FAA can't let this project fail because the amount of time, money, and man hours poured into the project would certainly precipitate a Congressional inquiry, so they are going to fight this lawsuit to the death to ensure that nothing confidential is released and the project reaches completion.

Between the contract extension, the NCEPT, and now this project, you are being bent over a hard park bench and fucking railroaded by your national leadership. We should all be appalled by this project and should be fucking roasting national to find out what the fuck is going on.

If you are correct that the two mystery NATCA people were Paul And Trish then I have a question for Santa. Hey Santa, why in the F@&k are Dean and the Special Counsel still employed by NATCA?

 

[GulfCharlie]

Preach.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, National doesn't care about us. They have become bigger than us, they are self serving. The FAA and NATCA have become one through collaboration.

It's time for serious change or the end of our union is near.

People have to run for national office, we need to push past this corrupt system of unlimited terms and the mentality that "People can just vote us out." Term limits across all aspects of the union would be a solid step forward.

 

[Ad1234]

Regardless of any preconceived attitudes you may have towards N90 as a facility or any personal enmity you have against the people who work there (anyone who works in an underlying or adjacent facility will attest that assholes abound), you should be appalled and disgusted by National's lack of representation of N90 controllers.

The union is obligated to negotiate on behalf of it's members, and the fact that the only union leadership involved in the negotiations were Paul, Trish, Dean, and 3 NATCA lawyers is abhorrent. At no point were the FacReps of N90 or PHL consulted prior to the signing of the initial MOU between NATCA national and the FAA. Members weren't consulted on . The union and FAA have workgroups on fucking EVERYTHING...wake turbulence, stripless towers, etc... so the fact that nobody else was brought into the project would certainly indicate to me that upper union wanted to maintain utmost secrecy because they wanted to leverage their complicity and cooperation in this project against another project somewhere else.

The FAA has dumped so much money into this project that they're determined to ram it down our throats and get it across the finish line at all costs because of the sheer amount of money that has been poured into the project. Tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars have been spent on this project to this point, and so there are most certainly people in the ATO and other organizations who are making this their culminating career project...whether the project happens is going to make or break a lot of careers. The FAA can't let this project fail because the amount of time, money, and man hours poured into the project would certainly precipitate a Congressional inquiry, so they are going to fight this lawsuit to the death to ensure that nothing confidential is released and the project reaches completion.

Between the contract extension, the NCEPT, and now this project, you are being bent over a hard park bench and fucking railroaded by your national leadership. We should all be appalled by this project and should be fucking roasting national to find out what the fuck is going on.

Maybe the union DID negotiate on behalf of their members. 100k was offered but they realized that once the workforce found out, and the overwhelming perception (not reality) that N90 gets everything despite their self sabotaging, they thought it would be a bad idea and would have way more members complaining they didn’t get theirs.

 

[DankVectorz]

Maybe the union DID negotiate on behalf of their members. 100k was offered but they realized that once the workforce found out, and the overwhelming perception (not reality) that N90 gets everything despite their self sabotaging, they thought it would be a bad idea and would have way more members complaining they didn’t get theirs.

Sure sure fuck me cause the membership believes everything they read on the internet

 

[Dolan]

I wonder if a lot of people feel really dumb for not voting for Zilonis.

 

[Phillyman2633]

Maybe the union DID negotiate on behalf of their members. 100k was offered but they realized that once the workforce found out, and the overwhelming perception (not reality) that N90 gets everything despite their self sabotaging, they thought it would be a bad idea and would have way more members complaining they didn’t get theirs.

So you would be fine with favoritism on a facility-to-facility basis and lack the mental acuity to understand the implications on the rest of the NAS if NATCA hides information from their membership and allows the FAA to operate outside the scope of established law (the 804 process)?

Cool fuckin story bro

 

[Peter Gibbons]

Maybe the union DID negotiate on behalf of their members. 100k was offered but they realized that once the workforce found out, and the overwhelming perception (not reality) that N90 gets everything despite their self sabotaging, they thought it would be a bad idea and would have way more members complaining they didn’t get theirs.

"Sure the e board came to my house upper decked my toilet, drank all my beer and banged my girlfriend, but look at this cool branded towel they gave me to clean up with (available on the natca members only site, $19.95). I didn't find out about any of this till I got home from my mid, but I'm sure it's in my best interest, and if you don't think so you must be anti labor"



-Ad1234 (probably)

 

[Mayhem1369]

Spicy spicy

Well then… shots fired.. lol

Regardless of any preconceived attitudes you may have towards N90 as a facility or any personal enmity you have against the people who work there (anyone who works in an underlying or adjacent facility will attest that assholes abound), you should be appalled and disgusted by National's lack of representation of N90 controllers.

The union is obligated to negotiate on behalf of it's members, and the fact that the only union leadership involved in the negotiations were Paul, Trish, Dean, and 3 NATCA lawyers is abhorrent. At no point were the FacReps of N90 or PHL consulted prior to the signing of the initial MOU between NATCA national and the FAA. Members weren't consulted on . The union and FAA have workgroups on fucking EVERYTHING...wake turbulence, stripless towers, etc... so the fact that nobody else was brought into the project would certainly indicate to me that upper union wanted to maintain utmost secrecy because they wanted to leverage their complicity and cooperation in this project against another project somewhere else.

The FAA has dumped so much money into this project that they're determined to ram it down our throats and get it across the finish line at all costs because of the sheer amount of money that has been poured into the project. Tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars have been spent on this project to this point, and so there are most certainly people in the ATO and other organizations who are making this their culminating career project...whether the project happens is going to make or break a lot of careers. The FAA can't let this project fail because the amount of time, money, and man hours poured into the project would certainly precipitate a Congressional inquiry, so they are going to fight this lawsuit to the death to ensure that nothing confidential is released and the project reaches completion.

Between the contract extension, the NCEPT, and now this project, you are being bent over a hard park bench and fucking railroaded by your national leadership. We should all be appalled by this project and should be fucking roasting national to find out what the fuck is going on.

Yeah. Everyone SHOULD be appalled by this, because you could be next. All the back-door, bullshit agreements made between people outside the building… it’s pretty fucked up. Some of us just want to know where the fuck we will be living come September- you know, so we can figure out where our kids are gonna school, shit like that. Personally, I don’t like being bullshitted by someone who isn’t even smart enough to stick to his own bullshit story, and got caught lying and contradicting himself at least TWICE on the Telecon I was on. Fuck those guys.

 

[Ad1234]

Sure sure fuck me cause the membership believes everything they read on the internet

People are irrational, you read these shit posts.

"Sure the e board came to my house upper decked my toilet, drank all my beer and banged my girlfriend, but look at this cool branded towel they gave me to clean up with (available on the natca members only site, $19.95). I didn't find out about any of this till I got home from my mid, but I'm sure it's in my best interest, and if you don't think so you must be anti labor"



-Ad1234 (probably)

The upper deck is over the line. But funny !

 

[Bandit117]

Yeah. Everyone SHOULD be appalled by this, because you could be next. All the back-door, bullshit agreements made between people outside the building… it’s pretty fucked up. Some of us just want to know where the fuck we will be living come September- you know, so we can figure out where our kids are gonna school, shit like that. Personally, I don’t like being bullshitted by someone who isn’t even smart enough to stick to his own bullshit story, and got caught lying and contradicting himself at least TWICE on the Telecon I was on. Fuck those guys.

Tell us more about this telecon?

 

[avgeek11]

Tell us more about this telecon?

Not today Management, not today..

 

[boots]

Better get n90 over there quick. PHL already below the threshold to get downgraded (that will never happen)

 

[slater]

Better get n90 over there quick. PHL already below the threshold to get downgraded (that will never happen)

PHL only needs to be above threshold for 4 months a year and summer traffic will solve that.