2024 NATCA President Election

[ManBearPig]

Remind me again why you're against "privatizing" into a non-profit user funded ANSP that isn't run by a bunch of dysfunctional dipshits in DC?

Because it would be run by a bunch of corporate dipshits who only care about their own bottom line, not the safety nor non Part 121 users in the NAS.

 

[Acquired Taste]

Because they’ll take our pensions

Valid concern but anything can be negotiated, pensions included. The pension is obviously one of the biggest draws to this job, and without it, attracting and retaining people would be nearly impossible unless overall compensation was drastically increased to a level that was competitive to what pilots and other professionals make. I'm sure at the very least, those with pensions would be grandfathered in.

Because it would be run by a bunch of corporate dipshits who only care about their own bottom line, not the safety nor non Part 121 users in the NAS.

There would still be still be a regulatory body and oversight that made sure service wasn't impacted. They could even do something like for every controller the new ANSP is staffed under 85%, they have to pay a fine of $1 million per controller for every year that is the case. For example, if actual staffing of 85% is 12,000 CPCs and the actual staffing is 11,900, they would owe $100 million. The $100M could be split up even and distributed as a bonus to all the CPCs as a bonus. The ANSP would also be legally liable for negligence and controller incompetence similar to how the FAA is currently sued by people trying to secure the bag. There would be an incentive to be safe and efficient but everyone either loves to ignore that part or is too dumb to understand it.

Or I guess we could just keep on doing exactly what we're doing now and hope things change. Don't worry, big NATCA is fighting hard for you everyday. Just keep that due money flowing in the meantime though. Maybe you'll get a 2 day weekend and a raise that keeps up with inflation so you don't have to work 6 days a week to still just live paycheck to paycheck. With the rapid pace of improvements coming down the pipeline and making their way through Congress, I'm sure you'll be able to make it to your kid's tee ball game before the cat's in the cradle.

 

[FightingIrish2012]

Valid concern but anything can be negotiated, pensions included. The pension is obviously one of the biggest draws to this job, and without it, attracting and retaining people would be nearly impossible unless overall compensation was drastically increased to a level that was competitive to what pilots and other professionals make. I'm sure at the very least, those with pensions would be grandfathered in.


There would still be still be a regulatory body and oversight that made sure service wasn't impacted. They could even do something like for every controller the new ANSP is staffed under 85%, they have to pay a fine of $1 million per controller for every year that is the case. For example, if actual staffing of 85% is 12,000 CPCs and the actual staffing is 11,900, they would owe $100 million. The $100M could be split up even and distributed as a bonus to all the CPCs as a bonus. The ANSP would also be legally liable for negligence and controller incompetence similar to how the FAA is currently sued by people trying to secure the bag. There would be an incentive to be safe and efficient but everyone either loves to ignore that part or is too dumb to understand it.

Or I guess we could just keep on doing exactly what we're doing now and hope things change. Don't worry, big NATCA is fighting hard for you everyday. Just keep that due money flowing in the meantime though. Maybe you'll get a 2 day weekend and a raise that keeps up with inflation so you don't have to work 6 days a week to still just live paycheck to paycheck. With the rapid pace of improvements coming down the pipeline and making their way through Congress, I'm sure you'll be able to make it to your kid's tee ball game before the cat's in the cradle.

I agree with all this. The new accepted acronym for “CPC” should be Consolidate - Privatize - Compensate. Because that’s what would happen, our compensation would go through the roof, look at Canada.

 

[Foppery&Whim]

With privatization the major losers would be the Part 121 and GA. There's a reason why we have equal access in the NAS and not constant denial of services like Canada/EU, where it goes to the highest bidder. You can pretty much kiss our robust GA industry goodbye and also the economic benefit it provides to the towns & communities throughout the US. Don't get me wrong, I love my paycheck to go through the roof but privatization is just one trade-off with a whole bunch of unintended consequences.

 

[32andBelow]

With privatization the major losers would be the Part 121 and GA. There's a reason why we have equal access in the NAS and not constant denial of services like Canada/EU, where it goes to the highest bidder. You can pretty much kiss our robust GA industry goodbye and also the economic benefit it provides to the towns & communities throughout the US. Don't get me wrong, I love my paycheck to go through the roof but privatization is just one trade-off with a whole bunch of unintended consequences.

Nah private jets are part of GA and they buy plenty of fuel

 

[FightingIrish2012]

I think GA would be fine. Plus even if their costs go up who cares? Anyone who is full or part owner of a plane must be the "1%" and we all have to hate those people, right lol?

 

[jorgeluis161]

I agree with all this. The new accepted acronym for “CPC” should be Consolidate - Privatize - Compensate. Because that’s what would happen, our compensation would go through the roof, look at Canada.

That's is just a stupid idea.... sorry to say but privatization of ATC is stupid. Look at the FCT towers now...

 

[FightingIrish2012]

That's is just a stupid idea.... sorry to say but privatization of ATC is stupid. Look at the FCT towers now...

FCT's are for profit private companies, the ATC privatization would have been something different. It's all in the past and will never happen though unless they write it into FAA Reauthorization one day like the N90 consolidation.

 

[32andBelow]

FCT's are for profit private companies, the ATC privatization would have been something different. It's all in the past and will never happen though unless they write it into FAA Reauthorization one day like the N90 consolidation.

It would probably be something like the post office

 

[GulfCharlie]

It would probably be something like the post office

Go on the way back archive and read the FederalSoup (RIP to the best info ever) forum for the Post Office employees.

 

[32andBelow]

Go on the way back archive and read the FederalSoup (RIP to the best info ever) forum for the Post Office employees.

I’m not saying it would be good or bad just that it would be like them. They fund themselves but their still gov kinda

 

[jorgeluis161]

FCT's are for profit private companies, the ATC privatization would have been something different. It's all in the past and will never happen though unless they write it into FAA Reauthorization one day like the N90 consolidation.

Doesn't make it a good idea regardless

 

[Move78]

Valid concern but anything can be negotiated, pensions included. The pension is obviously one of the biggest draws to this job, and without it, attracting and retaining people would be nearly impossible unless overall compensation was drastically increased to a level that was competitive to what pilots and other professionals make. I'm sure at the very least, those with pensions would be grandfathered in.


There would still be still be a regulatory body and oversight that made sure service wasn't impacted. They could even do something like for every controller the new ANSP is staffed under 85%, they have to pay a fine of $1 million per controller for every year that is the case. For example, if actual staffing of 85% is 12,000 CPCs and the actual staffing is 11,900, they would owe $100 million. The $100M could be split up even and distributed as a bonus to all the CPCs as a bonus. The ANSP would also be legally liable for negligence and controller incompetence similar to how the FAA is currently sued by people trying to secure the bag. There would be an incentive to be safe and efficient but everyone either loves to ignore that part or is too dumb to understand it.

Or I guess we could just keep on doing exactly what we're doing now and hope things change. Don't worry, big NATCA is fighting hard for you everyday. Just keep that due money flowing in the meantime though. Maybe you'll get a 2 day weekend and a raise that keeps up with inflation so you don't have to work 6 days a week to still just live paycheck to paycheck. With the rapid pace of improvements coming down the pipeline and making their way through Congress, I'm sure you'll be able to make it to your kid's tee ball game before the cat's in the cradle.

It’s not just about me and my. Even if my pension gets grandfathered we have an obligation to look out for the new guys. They already make the new guys pay more.
I don’t believe they’ll have any problem retaining controllers. But I could be wrong. I have no idea if privatization would generate more compensation. Detaching from government is scary because the private sector is ruthless. Even if they didn’t move money around laterally to get the courts to kill the pensions they’d be better off hiring a billion new controllers and then laying off all the old guys with a bloated salary and poof, problem solved.

 

[GulfCharlie]

I’m not saying it would be good or bad just that it would be like them. They fund themselves but their still gov kinda

Understood, just interesting to read what all their issues were. Not speaking negative or positive, just interesting.

 

[KP-ATC]

Because it would be run by a bunch of corporate dipshits who only care about their own bottom line, not the safety nor non Part 121 users in the NAS.

One needs to look no farther than FSS to see how this would go.

 

[J-one-s]

One needs to look no farther than FSS to see how this would go.

Lol 4 hub facilities with controllers working level 7 and below camera "towers", getting their bathroom breaks timed on one of the ops floor big screens.

 

[J8ke]

It’s not just about me and my. Even if my pension gets grandfathered we have an obligation to look out for the new guys. They already make the new guys pay more.
I don’t believe they’ll have any problem retaining controllers. But I could be wrong. I have no idea if privatization would generate more compensation. Detaching from government is scary because the private sector is ruthless. Even if they didn’t move money around laterally to get the courts to kill the pensions they’d be better off hiring a billion new controllers and then laying off all the old guys with a bloated salary and poof, problem solved.

That's exactly what happened at the consolidated and privatized flight service stations. They hired new FSS at cheaper wages with less benefits and management would constantly be searching for dirt to write up on the older ex-FAA employees to justify firing them.

 

[GulfCharlie]

That's exactly what happened at the consolidated and privatized flight service stations. They hired new FSS at cheaper wages with less benefits and management would constantly be searching for dirt to write up on the older ex-FAA employees to justify firing them.

Outside of the Alaskan AFSS, I was under the impression, via research, that all privatised FSS lost their pensions. with some even taking TSA jobs just to keep them until eligible for retirement.

 

[J8ke]

Outside of the Alaskan AFSS, I was under the impression, via research, that all privatised FSS lost their pensions. with some even taking TSA jobs just to keep them until eligible for retirement.

My trainer at privatised FSS had to get some random fed job at a museum for a few years so she could become eligible.

 

[GulfCharlie]

My trainer at privatised FSS had to get some random fed job at a museum for a few years so she could become eligible.

That makes sense, I was questioning my research for a minute 😂. Big RIP though for FSS people who got boned.