Pushed to the brink? Another NYT article rehashes all the problems that haven't changed since before Reagan and PATCO

[Sassyquatch]

1 is no longer a benefit if you have ot, also not everyone gets a mid.
2 management's lack of scheduling availability should not be a problem, we should be staffed. Rest is safety oriented, you can always reduce flows for staffing.
3/5 this is any job? Easier to plan a normal life with the rattler...maybe compared to throwing darts at a schedule, I'm sure for some a week of days and a week of nights would be better, this is at most personal preference
4 it doesn't suck equally the favorites get shift changes
6 maybe if it's straight mids it's the same stuff every day

4 is too true. We bid RDOs with the impression everyone works the rattler even though 90% of my facility hates it. Our schedule guy has a plan to include ONE line of straight days in the future. But here's the funny thing- we already have about 4 or 5 people working straight days, and then they use OT to cover their swing shifts so they can benefit from a better schedule while the rest of us have to work the rattler. They get away with it bc we're all on 6 day work weeks.

Now how do you convince people to change from the rattler to a week of days then a week of swings? I've brought it up to a majority of my coworkers and the only complaint I received from a few is that they'll never see their kids on the week of swings. & This is something I've been thinking about and already made a draft of it. Were also on 9-9-8-7-7 and it works out better when everyone is 5×8's, and you know how controllers are with change...

 

[Move78]

Do you really want the FAA to take over responsibility of setting our shifts? Why don’t you talk to coworkers and find out how many people like rattlers and how many don’t. Build a schedule that can please both. Right now at my facility, on each set of days off we have swing lines, day lines, a rattler with a mid, and several non-mid rattlers. The day lines have 1 early swing followed by 4 days, and the swing lines have 4 swings followed by a day.

MFs runnin 7 man crews and be like “wHy caNT yALl FiguRe yoUr schEdULes?”
Also these are all still rattlers

 

[Spiralbox21]

I personally like the rattler. Its like a 3 day weekend.

 

[32andBelow]

You’re above guidelines ever?

We are. The FAA has been going crazy to punish the better staffed places while still banning anyone to leave and go help a worse staffed place. It’s crazy.

 

[Bandit117]

Do you really want the FAA to take over responsibility of setting our shifts? Why don’t you talk to coworkers and find out how many people like rattlers and how many don’t. Build a schedule that can please both. Right now at my facility, on each set of days off we have swing lines, day lines, a rattler with a mid, and several non-mid rattlers. The day lines have 1 early swing followed by 4 days, and the swing lines have 4 swings followed by a day.

Nope.

 

[acutetriangles]

Some of you are just finding out people like different things. Wild.

 

[dingalings99]

I personally like the rattler. Its like a 3 day weekend.

yes but you are paying for it with your time and health every week, the 3 day weekend doesn't just magically appear out of no where

 

[ATOH]

I personally like the rattler. Its like a 3 day weekend.

It is fine you don't work OT.

However with many places on mandatory 6 day weeks it becomes brutal.

 

[Spiralbox21]

It is fine you don't work OT.

However with many places on mandatory 6 day weeks it becomes brutal.

I am on 6 day work weeks, but my OT every week is a mid. It would definitely be terrible if it was a day shift or something i agree.

 

[Soul_Controller]

We are. The FAA has been going crazy to punish the better staffed places while still banning anyone to leave and go help a worse staffed place. It’s crazy.

You gotta bait your supes. Get the denial and ask for spot leave in its place, then grieve the original denial. If denied for spot leave, article 8 the reasoning then see if the reasoning holds up (ie denied for staffing but you sat in the breakroom), if not, grieve the denial. It's a pain in the ass but dumb supes need to get put in line every now and then.

 

[AnyTrafficPleaseAdvise]

I personally like the rattler. It’s like a 3 day weekend.

To each their own. Personally, it takes me at least half a day to recover from the midnight shift and I usually still feel drowsy all day. I’m better off working a 5th day dayshift and feeling good when I get off work

 

[Kramer]

Nothing will change until people die from a mistake associated with fatigue. Hopefully that doesn't happen but when it does the faa will probably mandate 10 hours turns. Or maybe not.

 

[Soul_Controller]

Nothing will change until people die from a mistake associated with fatigue. Hopefully that doesn't happen but when it does the faa will probably mandate 10 hours turns. Or maybe not.

You guys underrate America's ability to blame the person and not the system

 

[DADDYSbabyBIRD]

You guys underrate America's ability to blame the person and not the system

And silly enough that's the exact opposite of how the FAA/NATCA works.

 

[Dontbotherme]

Have a minimum of 10 hour rest periods between shifts to reduce fatigue. Have a reduced time on the mid shift to reduce fatigue.
Mid line proposal…
Mon: 1400-2300 (9 hour shift)
Tue: 1100-1900
Wed: 0700-1500
Thu: 0530-1330
Thu into Fri: 2330-0630 (7 hour shift)

 

[Wizard]

Just close the tower/give the airspace to center and problem is solved.

 

[I.DO.VEHCTAHS]

That wasn’t me retard. Read the post again.

Yep. RAZE the congressional pay ceiling for this guy.

 

[Golf delta]

MFs runnin 7 man crews and be like “wHy caNT yALl FiguRe yoUr schEdULes?”
Also these are all still rattlers

I’ve done time at smaller facilities as well. There’s options for them too, guess I was just giving an example. My point is I’d rather have it the controllers have the power to make the change then be forced into a change that a good portion of the workforce doesn’t want. If the government is in charge of making a change, they usually mess it up and make it worse.

 

[Phillytroll69]

I’ve done time at smaller facilities as well. There’s options for them too, guess I was just giving an example. My point is I’d rather have it the controllers have the power to make the change then be forced into a change that a good portion of the workforce doesn’t want. If the government is in charge of making a change, they usually mess it up and make it worse.

We are almost as busy as ever with low safety incidents. The system is working great

 

[Bandit117]

Some of you are just finding out people like different things. Wild.

It doesn’t matter if you like it. It’s objectively bad, so likability is irrelevant. My kid might love ice cream for breakfast but it’s my job as the adult to say “no”.

The faa saying schedules are locally negotiated means that there isn’t any healthy food in the house, so they let the kids choose the junk food and then blame the kids when they get fat. Except junk food is the rattler and getting fat means early death.