Up/Down. Can a tower certified controller with OJTI training train someone in the tower before being CPC?

[FloopThePig]

Or do they need to CPC before they can train anyone else?

 

[32andBelow]

You need to be a CPC. Can’t train d sides at the center either. But I heard they used to back in the day.

 

[Bandit117]

Or do they need to CPC before they can train anyone else?

Yes, but if their radar training goes poorly the trb wont look favorably on mgmt for making a struggling trainee train another trainee. But it’s legal for someone to train others on positions they are certified on.

It’s frowned upon, you only usually see it when there is a critical shortage of staff

 

[Phanatical]

The order says “must be certified at the CPC/TMC/FPL level on the positions involved at a minimum of 12 months.”

 

[Golf delta]

I don’t think it’s allowed but regardless it’d be a terrible practice. For one, that instructor would likely not have very much time on the position to be comfortable. Second, the focus of any trainee should be certifying on the rest of their positions. Not training other controllers.

 

[Ad1234]

Yes, but if their radar training goes poorly the trb wont look favorably on mgmt for making a struggling trainee train another trainee. But it’s legal for someone to train others on positions they are certified on.

It’s frowned upon, you only usually see it when there is a critical shortage of staff

It’s more than frowned upon, It’s not allowed anccording to the order. unless they apply for a waiver. I’ve known of a few that have been approved. Particularly if the person has been certified elsewhere or have been certified in the tower a long time, had a lengthy delay for rtf, and don’t have many ojti.

If they don’t have a waiver the answer is no. If they haven’t it’s stupid they even sent them to ojti basics

 

[abc1234]

ZNY had a waiver for that and D2's were training AG's in the pit

 

[DankVectorz]

ZNY had a waiver for that and D2's were training AG's in the pit

I did my OJTI class at ZNY and out of 10 or 12 people only me and 1 other had ever talked to a plane before. The rest were ZNY’s trainees certified in The Pit getting ready to train the AG’s. Some of them had been at ZNY 3+ years and still didn’t know what area they were going to.

 

[wrench978]

We got a waiver to be able to train D sides before we hit a year CPC. We had a few controllers (myself included) who got D sides before Covid but CPCed after.

 

[BrocolliRob]

We used to have waivers so that people checked out on GC for 6+ months could train on GC/FD.

 

[eltors0]

I did my OJTI class at ZNY and out of 10 or 12 people only me and 1 other had ever talked to a plane before. The rest were ZNY’s trainees certified in The Pit getting ready to train the AG’s. Some of them had been at ZNY 3+ years and still didn’t know what area they were going to.

What is the pit?

 

[POINTOUT]

What is the pit?

Flight data basically

 

[Ad1234]

We used to have waivers so that people checked out on GC for 6+ months could train on GC/FD.

You don’t need a waiver for this if your trainee/cpc ratio is above 35 percent. It’s in the order.

 

[sheetshow]

Or do they need to CPC before they can train anyone else?

Consider taking time to research questions before asking them.

https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Order/JO_3120.4R.pdf

chapter 6. section 1.

 

[FightingIrish2012]

Consider taking time to research questions before asking them.

https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Order/JO_3120.4R.pdf

chapter 6. section 1.

Why so mean? Most people don’t know how to access that repository from home and at work it’s even hard to find as the search function is so fucked. Sometimes it’s easier to find an answer here with 900 people happy to give advice.