If I ran the FAA How I could fix the Training/Staffing Problem

A

atcrick

Member
Messages
40
I know this could go sideways quick, but lets give it a shot.
Lots of upper Management lurk here, Im retired FAA ATC Enroute/Terminal Controller,
This could be a productive way to get your voice heard.
(IF YOU RAN THE FAA HOW WOULD YOU FIX THE TRAINING/STAFFING/GETTING STUCK IN LOWER LEVEL FACILITIES)

I will kick it off:
If I ran the FAA I would totally revamp the OKC training/hiring process.
Lets take Enroute first. Lets say we need to staff ZOB they need 20 new CPC'S.
I revamp the Academy so that ZOB airspace and procedures are taught from day 1. No more Aero Center or Non Radar crap. Lets get down to business.
Bring in at least 3 CPC'S from ZOB and several retired ZOB controllers as instructors. 6 month detail for all instructors. or rotate CPC's from ZOB shorter duration.
Start selecting off the hiring list. Require new hires to sign a 5 year commitment to ZOB, if you withdraw from training or try to relocate in the 5 year window, you owe ZOB $10K.
select 40 applicants. Train the Developmental in their assigned area they will work at.
Train at the Academy until the student could walk into the center and certify on the D side in 1 month. The facility takes it from there.
this is the Enroute training plan in a nutshell.
Training failures may be offered a Lower level Terminal in the Boston area only.
You could run this model with other Centers at the Academy at the same time!

Please lets keep it productive, No bashing others (ME) LOL. FAA, Union, Trainee's, ect.
 
atcrick said:
Bring in at least 3 CPC'S from ZOB and several retired ZOB controllers as instructors. 6 month detail for all instructors. or rotate CPC's from ZOB shorter duration.
Start selecting off the hiring list. Require new hires to sign a 5 year commitment to ZOB, if you withdraw from training or try to relocate in the 5 year window, you owe ZOB $10K.
select 40 applicants. Train the Developmental in their assigned area they will work at.
Click to expand...

You lost me at this part. The only current CPCs "ZOB" should be able to assign to a detail should be people out on medical. That would work.

NO WAY would requiring someone to essentially sign a 5 year contract would be a good thing. And why are we trying to punish people by making them pay a $10k penalty? Lol what? Where would that money go?

I think your logic overall makes sense but there's way too much red tape that you're suggesting. How about start by assigning new hires to generally the area they want to be in with the hopes that they will stay longer than a year. Stop sending people from Oakland to New York.
 
dingalings99 said:
Or you can just hire and train locally because you already have people that live there

And then not have more bullshit details jfc
Click to expand...
Agree 100%. Z’s already have huge training departments in place. Simply expand them and you can eliminate OKC entirely. In the long run, it would cut costs, and increase retention. Obviously can’t do that on the terminal side where a lot of facilities just don’t have the infrastructure, but there is no reason what’s done in OKC for enroute couldn’t be accomplished at the ARTCC’s directly,
 
Hire locally for ALL facilities. Within a 100-200 mile radius. Make it easy for people to see family and friends. There’s 30-50k applicants for OTS bid every time. There’s zero reason to send Southern California to Maine or Washington to Florida.

Give bonus for training a DEV to completion for members of the training team. 20% is cool and all, but at a low level shit hole that’s 700 bucks pre tax for 100 hours of training. Not enough. If the OJTI’s work pays off give them a 2-3k bonus or something. Incentivize meaningful training and make trainers see shortcomings in their DEV.

Tower sims at seasonal facilities. Make useful training happen year round. Or at least have the option to send them on a month long detail to a place with a sim to get meaningful training. Or have a week long SET/SIT class with a sim to help them grasp concepts. This would cut training time down substantially if done correctly.

There’s more but these are my top 3.
 
The fix is not simple.

Upward mobility. Guaranteed career plan that gets you making from level 5 pay to level 12 (if desired) in 8 years or less. Hard to staff towers? GUARANTEE an escape to desired location and a timeline. This also let's you know when you'll need people instead of I just out in for a sup bid. (STRUCTURE LIKE GUAM BID, BUT FOR BAD FACILITIES HERE)

Get the bad facilities I'm shape (n90 seems to be improving greatly) but there are others. Nobody should have to wait YEARS to START training (pandemics aside) Make raises timed base-these delays (including pandemic) make it impossible to get a performance based raise. This kills tsp lifetime growth, delays your high three etc. Complete and utter disgust at this performance based system....that uh you can't perform for until we say it's OK? There needs to be a back up (like zny put position) at all facilities.

I'm excited for direct hiring with cti..BUT once again there is no standard. Make basics and map available for everyone free online. I'll narrate the powerpoints. If someone says they know it, make that part of the application.

Retention-Why aren't there more people in high up positions with qualified experience.
Things you can't do-go from a level 5 vfr tower to a level 12 tracon.

Things you can do- (if you know people)
Go from level 5 vfr tower to management at level 12 tracon
Go from level 5 vfr tower to traffic management at level 12 tracon

People want money and have no other way to get there. This is a huge shortcut around experience and ncept requirements.

Partially union aimed but hold people accountable-every detail should be required to maintain currency. People that haven't worked traffic in over 365 days are now a support role and should be taken off the numbers.


The hardest, staffed facilities get the lowest scorers and last picks for a reason. Some sort of living stipend or something might get people above 70.00% in okc to the right facilities.

For example- you live in Florida and went to embry riddle. You have a natural skill for atc and get 98% at the academy. Your family and support system is next door to ZMA.

You get the top of the list and go to Texas because it's closest.

Who goes to ACK, FAI, LA, Oakland, NY? The bottom of the list and volunteers. These facilities and trainees are set up for failure.
 
jfol said:
Hire locally for ALL facilities. Within a 100-200 mile radius. Make it easy for people to see family and friends. There’s 30-50k applicants for OTS bid every time. There’s zero reason to send Southern California to Maine or Washington to Florida.

Give bonus for training a DEV to completion for members of the training team. 20% is cool and all, but at a low level shit hole that’s 700 bucks pre tax for 100 hours of training. Not enough. If the OJTI’s work pays off give them a 2-3k bonus or something. Incentivize meaningful training and make trainers see shortcomings in their DEV.

Tower sims at seasonal facilities. Make useful training happen year round. Or at least have the option to send them on a month long detail to a place Hire locally for ALL facilities. Within a 100-200 mile radius. Make it easy for people to see family and friends. There’s 30-50k applicants for OTS bid every time. There’s zero reason to send Southern California to Maine or Washington to Florida.
Click to expand...
The sim part is so right it hurts. We can’t retain a training contractor long enough to do anything about it, and we have a 0 percent chance of being able to release a CPC to build sims. I can only tell a trainee so many times that that won’t work in July. I need to show them.

Phillytroll69 said:
The fix is not simple.

Upward mobility. Guaranteed career plan that gets you making from level 5 pay to level 12 (if desired) in 8 years or less. Hard to staff towers? GUARANTEE an escape to desired location and a timeline. This also let's you know when you'll need people instead of I just out in for a sup bid. (STRUCTURE LIKE GUAM BID, BUT FOR BAD FACILITIES HERE)

Get the bad facilities I'm shape (n90 seems to be improving greatly) but there are others. Nobody should have to wait YEARS to START training (pandemics aside) Make raises timed base-these delays (including pandemic) make it impossible to get a performance based raise. This kills tsp lifetime growth, delays your high three etc. Complete and utter disgust at this performance based system....that uh you can't perform for until we say it's OK? There needs to be a back up (like zny put position) at all facilities.

I'm excited for direct hiring with cti..BUT once again there is no standard. Make basics and map available for everyone free online. I'll narrate the powerpoints. If someone says they know it, make that part of the application.

Retention-Why aren't there more people in high up positions with qualified experience.
Things you can't do-go from a level 5 vfr tower to a level 12 tracon.

Things you can do- (if you know people)
Go from level 5 vfr tower to management at level 12 tracon
Go from level 5 vfr tower to traffic management at level 12 tracon

People want money and have no other way to get there. This is a huge shortcut around experience and ncept requirements.

Partially union aimed but hold people accountable-every detail should be required to maintain currency. People that haven't worked traffic in over 365 days are now a support role and should be taken off the numbers.


The hardest, staffed facilities get the lowest scorers and last picks for a reason. Some sort of living stipend or something might get people above 70.00% in okc to the right facilities.

For example- you live in Florida and went to embry riddle. You have a natural skill for atc and get 98% at the academy. Your family and support system is next door to ZMA.

You get the top of the list and go to Texas because it's closest.

Who goes to ACK, FAI, LA, Oakland, NY? The bottom of the list and volunteers. These facilities and trainees are set up for failure.
Click to expand...
I feel this as someone at FAI. We have a robust GA aviation community but can’t do anything about it. I know many people who would jump at the opportunity to try but we can’t hire directly.
 
bradlutz said:
I feel this as someone at FAI. We have a robust GA aviation community but can’t do anything about it. I know many people who would jump at the opportunity to try but we can’t hire directly.
Click to expand...
How many placements have you had that transferred out asap or withdrew....percentage estimate
 
bradlutz said:
The sim part is so right it hurts. We can’t retain a training contractor long enough to do anything about it, and we have a 0 percent chance of being able to release a CPC to build sims. I can only tell a trainee so many times that that won’t work in July. I need to show them.
Click to expand...
They could offer more FAA training jobs to people who age our or lose their medical. No one wants to go be a contractor
 
atcrick said:
I know this could go sideways quick, but lets give it a shot.
Lots of upper Management lurk here, Im retired FAA ATC Enroute/Terminal Controller,
This could be a productive way to get your voice heard.
(IF YOU RAN THE FAA HOW WOULD YOU FIX THE TRAINING/STAFFING/GETTING STUCK IN LOWER LEVEL FACILITIES)

I will kick it off:
If I ran the FAA I would totally revamp the OKC training/hiring process.
Lets take Enroute first. Lets say we need to staff ZOB they need 20 new CPC'S.
I revamp the Academy so that ZOB airspace and procedures are taught from day 1. No more Aero Center or Non Radar crap. Lets get down to business.
Bring in at least 3 CPC'S from ZOB and several retired ZOB controllers as instructors. 6 month detail for all instructors. or rotate CPC's from ZOB shorter duration.
Start selecting off the hiring list. Require new hires to sign a 5 year commitment to ZOB, if you withdraw from training or try to relocate in the 5 year window, you owe ZOB $10K.
select 40 applicants. Train the Developmental in their assigned area they will work at.
Train at the Academy until the student could walk into the center and certify on the D side in 1 month. The facility takes it from there.
this is the Enroute training plan in a nutshell.
Training failures may be offered a Lower level Terminal in the Boston area only.
You could run this model with other Centers at the Academy at the same time!

Please lets keep it productive, No bashing others (ME) LOL. FAA, Union, Trainee's, ect.
Click to expand...
huge flaw is that OKC doesn't wash out enough people. The academy is too easy, at my center we are getting so many retards now it is scary
 
Phillytroll69 said:
How many placements have you had that transferred out asap or withdrew....percentage estimate
Click to expand...
20 percent of people just nope out after they get into winter. Our real success rate is closer to 70 if you stick it out. It would probably be better if we had more OJTIs so we don’t have burn out.
 
atcrick said:
I know this could go sideways quick, but lets give it a shot.
Lots of upper Management lurk here, Im retired FAA ATC Enroute/Terminal Controller,
This could be a productive way to get your voice heard.
(IF YOU RAN THE FAA HOW WOULD YOU FIX THE TRAINING/STAFFING/GETTING STUCK IN LOWER LEVEL FACILITIES)

I will kick it off:
If I ran the FAA I would totally revamp the OKC training/hiring process.
Lets take Enroute first. Lets say we need to staff ZOB they need 20 new CPC'S.
I revamp the Academy so that ZOB airspace and procedures are taught from day 1. No more Aero Center or Non Radar crap. Lets get down to business.
Bring in at least 3 CPC'S from ZOB and several retired ZOB controllers as instructors. 6 month detail for all instructors. or rotate CPC's from ZOB shorter duration.
Start selecting off the hiring list. Require new hires to sign a 5 year commitment to ZOB, if you withdraw from training or try to relocate in the 5 year window, you owe ZOB $10K.
select 40 applicants. Train the Developmental in their assigned area they will work at.
Train at the Academy until the student could walk into the center and certify on the D side in 1 month. The facility takes it from there.
this is the Enroute training plan in a nutshell.
Training failures may be offered a Lower level Terminal in the Boston area only.
You could run this model with other Centers at the Academy at the same time!

Please lets keep it productive, No bashing others (ME) LOL. FAA, Union, Trainee's, ect.
Click to expand...
Damn I was really hoping for better effort than this. Tripped coming out of the blocks lol

6 month details to be away from family? Are we in the military?
 
32andBelow said:
They could offer more FAA training jobs to people who age our or lose their medical. No one wants to go be a contractor
Click to expand...
I agree. It’s been like pulling teeth for management to get a second staff suport just to catch us up cause we are so behind on some stuff.
 
Honestly, the number one thing that can be done to address the latent issues with staffing and training would be to get rid of the way they assign facilities and when they do it. Let people go to more specifically and narrowly defined geographic locations that they actually want to be in and make that known before the last days of OKC… Better retention, better motivation to perform with a higher quality of life (based on a desire to be in the environment you prefer to be in).

Of course there are a shit load more things that can be done to address more obvious problems, but I still think the FAA screwed itself by assigning facilities via the “go fuck yourself, our needs come first” methodology.
 

Similar threads

C
Fixing NCEPT/academy placement
2 3 4
Replies
78
Views
9K
SquawkHijack
SquawkHijack
Logical_Mongoose
FAA Safety Review Team Report 11/16/2023
5 6 7
Replies
122
Views
13K
ATCiscool
A
T
What do you want to see in the next contract and beyond?
8 9 10
Replies
199
Views
14K
jorgeluis161
J
GulfCharlie
Hiring Bid FAA-ATO-24-ALLSRCE-88674
Replies
5
Views
613
Hope
Hope
fivebyfive
FAA Reauthorization Act of 2023
7 8 9
Replies
177
Views
21K
Seeyoufly
S
Back
Top Bottom