Change in new hire personality type?

[HurryUpandWait]

7110.65 was written in blood. It didn't become so thick overnight by the "zoomers." ASDE-X had to be created to do our jobs for us because you geriatrics tried to kill so many people. Now it's actually tracked and logged by computers, who knows how many near misses and incursions happened back in the day because you just swept it under the rug or dropped your pen.

A couple memorable ones:
1991 - Controlller lands a plane on another one.
2006 - Lexington, KY - The controller at the time had been in the agency 17 years. Clears a dude for take off and kills everyone on board due to their failure to look where the plane was. But yeah that was a zoomer.


If any of you are interested in why some of the rules are in place, click this link and you'll see how people died a lot more often in aviation prior to the generation currently controlling. I also suggest you listen to the full 9/11 audio some time for air traffic. It's pretty crazy how no one really did anything until it was too late. Now you get a change of destination for an IFR and you have to notify the DEN asap.

Don’t let Coffee get hot!!

 

[boots]

7110.65 was written in blood. It didn't become so thick overnight by the "zoomers." ASDE-X had to be created to do our jobs for us because you geriatrics tried to kill so many people. Now it's actually tracked and logged by computers, who knows how many near misses and incursions happened back in the day because you just swept it under the rug or dropped your pen.

A couple memorable ones:
1991 - Controlller lands a plane on another one.
2006 - Lexington, KY - The controller at the time had been in the agency 17 years. Clears a dude for take off and kills everyone on board due to their failure to look where the plane was. But yeah that was a zoomer.


If any of you are interested in why some of the rules are in place, click this link and you'll see how people died a lot more often in aviation prior to the generation currently controlling. I also suggest you listen to the full 9/11 audio some time for air traffic. It's pretty crazy how no one really did anything until it was too late. Now you get a change of destination for an IFR and you have to notify the DEN asap.

Small note, but I don’t believe everyone died on that Lexington one.

 

[Phanatical]

Small note, but I don’t believe everyone died on that Lexington one.

Everyone but the first officer.

 

[Somenewguy]

Small note, but I don’t believe everyone died on that Lexington one.

That definitely discredits his point. If only 99% of occupants die, then it's hardly PRC worthy. Let alone worth writing an MOR.

 

[Phanatical]

That definitely discredits his point. If only 99% of occupants die, then it's hardly PRC worthy. Let alone worth writing an MOR.

49 deaths weren’t enough for the guy. He wanted the full 50.

 

[Usm4r1n3]

Here is my perspective after 18 years. Personality types can’t be captured in the hiring process, facility type and levels don’t always translate. I’ve seen highly skilled controllers at very high volume VFR towers and up downs struggle and/or not make it at Core 30 airports because the job doesn’t even translate at that point.

Instead of taking those controllers out for beers I’ve watched trainers just bash them without the offer to just talk to them and get to know them. And I’m sure they wanted beers after some training sessions. I’ve watched the ones who would swoon at the opportunity to just be part of the team and work 6 day weeks to be a part of the solution while not actually wanting to work the 6 day weeks. I don’t think the FAA has done justice in the hiring or training at all. We put time frames on them to protect trainers from burnout but also tie our hands behind our backs with the many hurdles to train right. Supervisors miss skill checks here and there, OJTI’s miss filling out training reports on time, and trainees don’t speak up because generational differences do exist.

Bottlenecks are a major issue at the academy. I hope we get away from just one entry point for inexperienced new hires soon.

But if the training order is tying hands and continues to give hours back to people not fit, over, and over, and over, and over, and over again then we will find ourselves frustrated to the point that we won’t give it our all and then the trainee gets hours reset again.

Judgment needs to be trusted with the trainers from start to finish. We don’t need training hours with the NTI. We need days, weeks, or months as an ultimate metric. And an honest talk with management needs to occur. The question of “can this person do the job?” Make it so much more personal to the trainee, personable to the robot management types out there, and manageable from the “follow the data” NTI diehards that can give everyone a reasonable chance at success.

***And now I will undercut my own point completely.

For f*cks sake. Can we let levels 6 and below hire off the street at their expense and find slots at entry level academy training or previous experience hiring waivers to help push the staffing at mid level facilities up through a national bid so that they level 7-9 facilities can release to the higher levels?

I mean, holy sh*t it’s not that hard. The agency loves taking us from midnight to 6 when any of us have a decent idea.