The upcoming stacked leave apocalypse

[Ad1234]

So if we lose money (diffs and other additional pay) in exchange for excused leave you say, "it's a wash." and we're more or less made whole. Then why would you then have a problem with people using use or lose leave by the end of the year...
"some facilities are still giving it out, are we are concerned with losing a few hours? entitlement much?" Why should people give hours back to the agency, what did they receive in return for those hours?
This year I bid Saturday/Sunday off. It's the first time in my adult life I was going to regularly have weekends off. We went to the 5/10s and I was fine with losing weekends in exchange for extra days off but now that we're working 5/5s, I don't really see this schedule as much of a win for me. While I get an extra 6 or 7 days off per month, I'm still working weekends. So I continue to work on days my wife has off, I continue to miss out on family events and hobbies. So on top of losing wages and weekends in exchange for a couple of extra weekdays off per month, you think I should give back my use or lose at the end of the year. Nope, not happening. You can bet your ass I'm not going to give back leave that I'm "entitled" to and earned.

we earn leave based on time worked according to the cba, correct?

we didn’t work thehours the contract says we would and we got paid for that time that we didn’t work, so now you are asking for pay we didn’t earn plus an additional day of pay and time off because you think it’s owed to you just by breathing in 2020. It’s Extremely petty. Because I think you already got the time off and you had the opportunity it’s to take that time if you bid it if it fell on one of your 5 days on.

 

[32andBelow]

we earn leave based on time worked according to the cba, correct?

we didn’t work thehours the contract says we would and we got paid for that time that we didn’t work, so now you are asking for pay we didn’t earn plus an additional day of pay and time off because you think it’s owed to you just by breathing in 2020. It’s Extremely petty. Because I think you already got the time off and you had the opportunity it’s to take that time if you bid it if it fell on one of your 5 days on.

we don’t accrue leave hourly

 

[Ad1234]

we don’t accrue leave hourly

Really? Thanks D2. We earn leave per pay period, which according to the contract is 80 hours worked. Since we aren’t doing that and are being gifted free time off, I could easily see the agency saying you’ve had the opportunity to use your leave, no one told you not to use it and you got free money, so go screw with you leave over 240. If you use 80 lwop you don’t earn, even though you are employed with the agency.

 

[BCHOOSIER]

Nothing is guaranteed in life, not a vector, a paycheck, a pay raise, nothing. You are worried about 16k while 100s of thousands of Americans have lost their lives and millions their income.

I'm trying my best to see where you're coming from, but have you thought that maybe, just maybe some need the money because they are married, live with , support, etc. those millions Americans that lost their income. I don't know why so many in this profession want to count other peoples money. I want everyone on here to make as much money as they can. If you can take advantage of a loophole and get paid, good for you. It means jack shit to me so why should I care. Listening to some on here tell others that 20K isn't much or not a big deal to lose is sickening. As you said nothing in life is guaranteed so they should be fighting to get theirs right now.

 

[PushingTin]

And you’re not going to train anytime soon so there’s that.

It’s amazing that you want to complain about center training and how you would be a CPC by now at a tower. You would literally be making the same amount of money as you do now except no actual path to six figures without a transfer and then more training.

One would be hard pressed to find a more self righteous, condescending, and less empathetic series of posts as yours in this thread. Everything finds balance in the end, and these negative waves are not good karma.

32andBelow in the other hand is spitting straight fire. Dragon Energy. Much props for standing up to the mob. Your hero's journey will find its end someday and you will be rewarded.

 

[32andBelow]

Really? Thanks D2. We earn leave per pay period, which according to the contract is 80 hours worked. Since we aren’t doing that and are being gifted free time off, I could easily see the agency saying you’ve had the opportunity to use your leave, no one told you not to use it and you got free money, so go screw with you leave over 240. If you use 80 lwop you don’t earn, even though you are employed with the agency.

You called it free leave earned. Like you didn’t earn it if you didn’t work 80 hours. But our leave isn’t hourly so it doesn’t matter

 

[BCHOOSIER]

You just said 40k would transform your life, and you are complaining on an air traffic forum, and you said you’ve complained about it at work or to the union. Clearly you do need it that bad.
Get a job Which you will quit and work for it. It’ll suck for a bit, but maybe it’ll ease the pain for you....but you probably don’t want to do that. Have you worked any another job before? Do that again if you can.

The man's got a job!

 

[Ad1234]

You called it free leave earned. Like you didn’t earn it if you didn’t work 80 hours. But our leave isn’t hourly so it doesn’t matter

but our schedules are hourly, so if you don’t work 2 weeks, which is 80 hours, You don’t earn the leave. If you take 2 weeks of annual or sick, that’s considered 2 weeks worked because you have previously earned that leave. If you elect to take leave without pay for 80 hours, or an entire pay periods worth of hours, you don’t earn the leave of that pay period the next time you get paid. I’m confused as to what you don’t understand.

 

[32andBelow]

but our schedules are hourly, so if you don’t work 2 weeks, which is 80 hours, You don’t earn the leave. If you take 2 weeks of annual or sick, that’s considered 2 weeks worked because you have previously earned that leave. If you elect to take leave without pay for 80 hours, or an entire pay periods worth of hours, you don’t earn the leave of that pay period the next time you get paid. I’m confused as to what you don’t understand.

And admin is the same. There’s no argument here. People are forced into the admin schedule so they accrue leave. It’s not LWOP

 

[Ad1234]

The man's got a job!

I get it, but the man claims he’s hungry and wants to train and needs the money, I’m saying That he won’t get his way,l right now with ATC, so go work for it else where. I said it would suck I said it wouldn’t be fun, but many of us worked 2 or more jobs at some point in our lives, Unfortunately he might have to do it now. I’m not saying it’s easy. But it’s the solution to his problems of being short the money and he can contribute to his Roth IRA on his own and it be tax free when he is miserable and old. See it as his annual bonus.

 

[32andBelow]

I get it, but the man claims he’s hungry and wants to train and needs the money, I’m saying That he won’t get his way,l right now with ATC, so go work for it else where. I said it would suck I said it wouldn’t be fun, but many of us worked 2 or more jobs at some point in our lives, Unfortunately he might have to do it now. I’m not saying it’s easy. But it’s the solution to his problems of being short the money and he can contribute to his Roth IRA on his own and it be tax free when he is miserable and old. See it as his annual bonus.

When did i ever say that? I said a 40k raise would tranform My life.

 

[Ad1234]

When did i ever say that? I said a 40k raise would tranform My life.

how is “transform your life” not the same thing as needing the money? You have wants and needs which 30k after taxes spread out over 26 pay checks, would be made easier. That’s when you Said it.

edit: if you got a job on the time you were off until a month ago, you would have earned 2500 a pay check from the faa plus whatever you earned stocking shelves at target. Plus the time you could have worked now You would have been better off than most. But no you didn’t want to do that. For the record, I make less than you do.

 

[32andBelow]

how is “transform your life” not the same thing as needing the money? You have wants and needs which 30k after taxes spread out over 26 pay checks, would be made easier. That’s when you Said it.

Lmao youre ridiculous bro

 

[Mike Kilo]

Side note.

While EA was awesome for me and some people enjoyed the time off, you were restricted on what you could do. 5 days of annual leave where you can travel, camp, get plastered 24/7, turn your phone off >>>>>>>>>> you are recallable and better get your ass to work within two hours of the phone call or prepare to get negative PRCs which has happened.

 

[32andBelow]

Side note.

While EA was awesome for me and some people enjoyed the time off, you were restricted on what you could do. 5 days of annual leave where you can travel, camp, get plastered 24/7, turn your phone off >>>>>>>>>> you are recallable and better get your ass to work within two hours of the phone call or prepare to get negative PRCs which has happened.

You don’t even have 2 consecutive RDOs

 

[TushingPin]

I went back a months go and my first 2 paychecks have been 200-400 higher each. Which is 8-15% increase on my take home. Granted there was a holiday. But collecting all the holidays is a couple grand a year. It might not be that much as a CPC but as a d2 it’s a pretty big deal.

how is “transform your life” not the same thing as needing the money? You have wants and needs which 30k after taxes spread out over 26 pay checks, would be made easier. That’s when you Said it.

edit: if you got a job on the time you were off until a month ago, you would have earned 2500 a pay check from the faa plus whatever you earned stocking shelves at target. Plus the time you could have worked now You would have been better off than most. But no you didn’t want to do that. For the record, I make less than you do.

My head is spinning circles at this point. I swear he originally said he wanted the money and was bullied by people who like time off. Fine. Go get another job and push it towards a 401K. Or better yet, up your TSP contribution to balance out your extra income now. I then heard "I'm missing out on training" well, sure. You are. It happens. But the last time I also checked, a 40k pay raise is by no means guaranteed. Anywho. Sounds like someone who Im sure we've all worked with before, never happy with the current situation

 

[Ad1234]

Lmao youre ridiculous bro

yeah bro since complaining about pennies doesn’t make you ridiculous?

Side note.

While EA was awesome for me and some people enjoyed the time off, you were restricted on what you could do. 5 days of annual leave where you can travel, camp, get plastered 24/7, turn your phone off >>>>>>>>>> you are recallable and better get your ass to work within two hours of the phone call or prepare to get negative PRCs which has happened.

What does a PRC really do? They don’t transfer facilities and are only used for your performance reviews which no manager ever gives you a bad review nor are your almost guaranteed raises ever affected because of it. Also, the union did back the agency up on this saying yeah you are getting free leave you need to be able to come back to work if needed, that’s not being unrealistic or out of line.

 

[Mike Kilo]

yeah bro since complaining about pennies doesn’t make you ridiculous?

What does a PRC really do? They don’t transfer facilities and are only used for your performance reviews which no manager ever gives you a bad review nor are your almost guaranteed raises ever affected because of it. Also, the union did back the agency up on this saying yeah you are getting free leave you need to be able to come back to work if needed, that’s not being unrealistic or out of line.

I didn’t say it was. I think people should suck it up and get to work when called. It is what makes the schedule work longer, we need to work with management on this. I said that your time off on EA is not the same thing as taking annual leave which is the stance some people took above. I would value 80-100 hours of annual far above being in a recallable position and unable to travel.
I must be weird in that I try to stay out of trouble ( it’s not hard) and am already at my facility of preference so why would I stack my file up with negative shit and make management hate me? Be pretty stupid when management can make your life annoying without breaking contract.

 

[Phillytroll69]

Here's something else-40k means 20k in tsp and another 20 for life. So in 3 years it's 60k in ur tsp and a down payment on a house. I worked two jobs when I first started out, but tell me what each year of a compound return and stock market equals.

It's really empathetic to tell the new guys hurry up and wait, be seen and not heard, enjoy your time off. Should have gotten another job when there's record high unemployment.

 

[BCHOOSIER]

we earn leave based on time worked according to the cba, correct?

we didn’t work thehours the contract says we would and we got paid for that time that we didn’t work, so now you are asking for pay we didn’t earn plus an additional day of pay and time off because you think it’s owed to you just by breathing in 2020. It’s Extremely petty. Because I think you already got the time off and you had the opportunity it’s to take that time if you bid it if it fell on one of your 5 days on.

Okay, since you asked the question I'll be glad to help you understand. You referred to the CBA, so please go back and read Section 29 and how it defines excused absence. I think you'll see that it clearly defines excused absence and pay close attention to the part about ... WITHOUT LOSS OF, CHARGE TO, OR REDUCTION OF AN EMPLOYEE'S LEAVE, PAY, OR BENEFITS. Now go to your LES and see the hours you were placed on excused absence. I hope this helps you with understanding how this all works. After all we are subject to recall during excused absence which was recently outline nationally. If you need the guidance I'll be happy to forward it to you, just let me know.
See, it's not me being "petty" but rather it's outlined in the CBA that I'm entitled to my leave. I'm sorry YOU think I, "already got the time off..." and should not be able to used my leave, but at the end of the day it's not your call. Furthermore, using the CBA, it clearly outlines how PTL, NPTL, and Spot leave will work. Hope this helps.