2024 NATCA President Election

[EightTwoSierra]

I said almost the same thing 3 years ago; I only dropped levels 4 and 5 then, but I am with you at this point now that 7 should be the new baseline going forward.

There needs to be a realignment in levels that puts everyone on a better footing while also still incentivizing busier/more complex facilities. In all likelihood AG pay needs to be adjusted to something closer to the D1 band as well to help alleviate that as a pressure point; worrying about pinching every penny while in training can be just as much of a stressor as fatigue. My first facility (level 5) didn't want to D3 anyone (no D1 or D2) and wanted to go straight from AG to CPC and that was a metric-ton of bullshit, even for a shit-kicker level 5. Living in a high COLA area on AG pay might technically be plausible, but it shouldn't be celebrated as a sadistic rite of passage that some people make it out to be.

The June raises also need an overhaul as well. Something as "simple" as making it ~2.4% and being permanently cumulative; not impacted by moving facilities or stages of training. That would be on track to get to top of the pay band in roughly 15 years regardless of career movement, which seems reasonable.

There should also be better incentives on the back-end as well. With pensions and social security constantly being at risk, it would be nice to see an increase in TSP matching that would incentivize people to save more for retirement as opposed to many who only match the 5% and don't think about it until the last several years of their career. Since ya'll have a MRA there should be something like a full 9% matching to make the federal government set a standard going forward; I know of many in the private sector being offered 7.5% matching on 10% contribution (100% on the first 5% and 50% on every % up to 10%).

And after seeing the unfortunate news out of ZID, medical needs a f***ing overhaul. Yesterday. F*** any career that bullies you into being afraid of taking care of yourself. NATCA should have been shouting about medical from the rooftops for years now and is doing a disservice to everyone for not planting their flag on that hill.

This is all wishful thinking, but it is the holiday season after all.

What happened at ZID? I miss something?

 

[Logical_Mongoose]

What happened at ZID? I miss something?

Another controller unable to reach out for needed help.

 

[NotKC]

What happened at ZID? I miss something?

They had a controller commit suicide.

 

[EightTwoSierra]

They had a controller commit suicide.

Aw jeez that’s terrible…

 

[ClearanceClarence]

As far as the levels discussion goes, is there any other federal agency that structures their pay in a similar way to us? Do TSA agents that work at some tiny airport with one or two CRJ flights a day make 1/4 of what agents at ATL or JFK make? I can see why there needs to be some incentives for higher level facilities, but it doesn’t make sense that through the hiring/Academy lottery, someone could end up making $75K as a CPC or $200K+. The gap for doing the same job is far too wide.

 

[Termine]

I know that the Forest Service and especially the Federal firefighters get absolutely boned on pay. Low GS levels and often part-time or summer-only work. It's shameful.

As far as the TSA, this website (not a .gov website) says that as of 2021 Transportation Security Officers fall into just two possible pay bands. A quick browse of USAJOBS seems to confirm that. We have with-locality starting pay:

LAW Lawton, OK $38k
IAD $43k
CMX Calumet, MI $38k
BIL Billings, MT $41k
DCA $43k
EWR $44k

So it's a very narrow band regardless of how busy the airport is. Of course it's a lot easier to hire and train TSA folks and then just open up a new line compared to training ATC and opening up a new position... and that's if the facility/airspace/airport configuration even allows for another position. There was a thread on reddit a couple days ago about LGA ground and people were saying it wouldn't make any sense to have GC1 and GC2. It has to be one person dealing with the whole field.

 

[ClearanceClarence]

On another unrelated but similar note (and I’m aware this is a Fed employee thing and not specific to the FAA), but the whole locality pay system needs to be abolished and replaced. Comparing federal employee to private sector salaries to determine locality is fucking stupid. Local pay adjustments need to be be based on cost of living, with housing being one of the biggest factors. It’s fucking ridiculous that someone in Houston can collect 35% locality when you can basically buy a mansion in the area for under $500K. Likewise, there are places that are expensive as hell to live in that get lumped into “rest of U.S.” and the people there get fucked.

 

[J8ke]

So it's a very narrow band regardless of how busy the airport is. Of course it's a lot easier to hire and train TSA folks and then just open up a new line compared to training ATC and opening up a new position... and that's if the facility/airspace/airport configuration even allows for another position. There was a thread on reddit a couple days ago about LGA ground and people were saying it wouldn't make any sense to have GC1 and GC2. It has to be one person dealing with the whole field.

DCA 🙂

https://www.reddit.com/r/ATC/s/CYPpYhJrK1

 

[echster]

You may get an idea of how the next contract negotiations will turn out as early as this year. The extensions for the Light Blue (2011 - mostly Region X) and Purple (2013 - some Region X, some staff 2152s) Books, which were signed at the same time as for the Slate Book, expire in July 2024. I have to believe the union has already been conducting mock negotiation sessions.

 

[Wizard]

You may get an idea of how the next contract negotiations will turn out as early as this year. The extensions for the Light Blue (2011 - mostly Region X) and Purple (2013 - some Region X, some staff 2152s) Books, which were signed at the same time as for the Slate Book, expire in July 2024. I have to believe the union has already been conducting mock negotiation sessions.

What are you talking about brother. 3 more days until we are all getting a raise.

 

[twn]

What are you talking about brother. 3 more days until we are all getting a raise.

Raze wen

 

[Raise when?]

 

[FightingIrish2012]

View attachment 9149

Remember when they were selling $70 sweatpants and when they were selling a shirt commemorating the 100th anniversary of women's right to vote and on the website you order them at, there was a counter displayed (I'm sure by mistake) how many were ordered of every product, and the count for that shirt about a week after it was on sale was at one (1)?

But more importantly, I think this is one of the darkest days in our careers. Do you think the RAZEWEN movement died today? If they are really not going to renegotiate util 2026 I would say it's fucking dead. ABACUS is not going to find hidden traffic not being counted now and lead to upgrades except for one or two centers, but it's going to expose and eliminate the few remaining ways facilities are overcounting traffic and lead to more downgrades. I won't even comment on the commercial space and "half the people on this call will have a 185K four-person drone" bullshit.

People in low level facilities are not going to wait around to 2026 just to get fucked again. I guarantee anyone in a situation like that who has been paying attention to this and saw that video today is getting their resume together. Resignations will be up, and it will cause them to put an emergency freeze of transfers (which will then drive resignations higher lol).

 

[Mike Kilo]

Remember when they were selling $70 sweatpants and when they were selling a shirt commemorating the 100th anniversary of women's right to vote and on the website you order them at, there was a counter displayed (I'm sure by mistake) how many were ordered of every product, and the count for that shirt about a week after it was on sale was at one (1)?

But more importantly, I think this is one of the darkest days in our careers. Do you think the RAZEWEN movement died today? If they are really not going to renegotiate util 2026 I would say it's fucking dead. ABACUS is not going to find hidden traffic not being counted now and lead to upgrades except for one or two centers, but it's going to expose and eliminate the few remaining ways facilities are overcounting traffic and lead to more downgrades. I won't even comment on the commercial space and "half the people on this call will have a 185K four-person drone" bullshit.

People in low level facilities are not going to wait around to 2026 just to get fucked again. I guarantee anyone in a situation like that who has been paying attention to this and saw that video today is getting their resume together. Resignations will be up, and it will cause them to put an emergency freeze of transfers (which will then drive resignations higher lol).

There was no movement. Just trolls on forums making shit up.

 

[FightingIrish2012]

There was no movement. Just trolls on forums making shit up.

If that’s all it was they did a good job getting Santa/Mick to release how many videos addressing it and getting the deaf mute, idiot opponents to at least write about it on their AOL style website. No results but it was the talk of the union nation wide for a couple months.

 

[Raise when?]

Remember when they were selling $70 sweatpants and when they were selling a shirt commemorating the 100th anniversary of women's right to vote and on the website you order them at, there was a counter displayed (I'm sure by mistake) how many were ordered of every product, and the count for that shirt about a week after it was on sale was at one (1)?

But more importantly, I think this is one of the darkest days in our careers. Do you think the RAZEWEN movement died today? If they are really not going to renegotiate util 2026 I would say it's fucking dead. ABACUS is not going to find hidden traffic not being counted now and lead to upgrades except for one or two centers, but it's going to expose and eliminate the few remaining ways facilities are overcounting traffic and lead to more downgrades. I won't even comment on the commercial space and "half the people on this call will have a 185K four-person drone" bullshit.

People in low level facilities are not going to wait around to 2026 just to get fucked again. I guarantee anyone in a situation like that who has been paying attention to this and saw that video today is getting their resume together. Resignations will be up, and it will cause them to put an emergency freeze of transfers (which will then drive resignations higher lol).

Morale has never been lower. Wars are won and lost on morale; not only does the FAA not see this, they don’t care, and they’re not even trying to fix the issue. Unfortunately we will see more and more mass resignations, and gofundme’s for even worse……

“In war the moral is to the physical as three to one."—NAPOLEON

 

[32andBelow]

I think a lot more people are going to leave the union this year than people expect.

 

[GulfBravoPapa]

I feel like that gets said every year.

 

[32andBelow]

I feel like that gets said every year.

They never release the numbers. But it just seems it’s so excepted now not the be in the union more and more are just putting in paperwork cus it’s not scary anymore. Maybe it’s different in different places of the country.

 

[Sassyquatch]

They never release the numbers. But it just seems it’s so excepted now not the be in the union more and more are just putting in paperwork cus it’s not scary anymore. Maybe it’s different in different places of the country.

I've actually heard from an increasing number of people at my facility say they're giving the union one more year to address pay & start working on a raise before they leave. I'm planning on doing the same. Regardless of how much work our local does (which we do have a great rep here), if national doesn't step up then what's the point in giving money to a union who pays exorbitant consulting fees to Rinaldi without ever negotiating a better contract?