Shoot The Breeze

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Mike Kilo said:
Must be nice! I’ve been recalled and working a normal schedule with OT mixed in for over two months now. So I get to work next to everyone without social distancing but not train because NATCA wants you to keep 5/5.
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I’m sorry. If we get off 5/5 to resume training, we’ll definitely go back to 6/1....
 
Spoony90 said:
I bet there’s some Vietnamese that would disagree and also, most military wouldn’t attack civilians. They are loyal to the constitution, not some stupid politician
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The Vietnamese won because the population of the US got tired of committing war crimes and having their soldiers return crippled from a war that no one wanted to even go to in the first place. The win conditions that the U.S. wanted were impossible. If the U.S. wanted to "win" by permanently establishing a pro-democracy Vietnam government they would have had to eradicate all Viet Cong leaders and communist support for Vietnam (which would mean war with Russia and China) as well.

Technology is different today.

If a rebel militia decided to hide in the forest in the U.S. and tried to be hostile to the U.S, the U.S. would probably just firebomb the shit out of everyone and know where everyone was from thermal imaging. They could find communication devices they were using (every cell phone is a tracker) and know exactly who was involved. They know exactly where every tree, rock, and cave is. You can't just hide in a mountain outpost anymore and expect to win against the U.S military. They got Osama halfway across the word, you think they can't get you and your buddies with guns on their own home turf?


Agree about the military not attacking civilians though. They'd probably just split into factions
 
ONE said:
The Vietnamese won because the population of the US got tired of committing war crimes and having their soldiers return crippled from a war that no one wanted to even go to in the first place. The win conditions that the U.S. wanted were impossible. If the U.S. wanted to "win" by permanently establishing a pro-democracy Vietnam government they would have had to eradicate all Viet Cong leaders and communist support for Vietnam (which would mean war with Russia and China) as well.

Technology is different today.

If a rebel militia decided to hide in the forest in the U.S. and tried to be hostile to the U.S, the U.S. would probably just firebomb the shit out of everyone and know where everyone was from thermal imaging. They could find communication devices they were using (every cell phone is a tracker) and know exactly who was involved. They know exactly where every tree, rock, and cave is. You can't just hide in a mountain outpost anymore and expect to win against the U.S military. They got Osama halfway across the word, you think they can't get you and your buddies with guns on their own home turf?


Agree about the military not attacking civilians though. They'd probably just split into factions
Click to expand...


I feel the need to chime in here so please forgive me.

You forget that the North Vietnamese were ideologically committed individuals who were ready and willing to implement Vietnamese independence at all costs after years of occupation. The Vietnam war started out as such but eventually morphed into the position of Vietnamisation, hoping that the South Vietnamese would be able to stand up against the National Liberation Front for South Vietnam (Viet Cong) and PAVN incursions form the North and West. The Viet Cong started out a multiparty organisation with the aim of driving out all "oppressors" but with attrition and Hanoi's influence, the multiparty individuals that were left became marginalised thereby ensuring Hanoi's complete control over the Viet Cong.

We have not even covered the Republic of Vietnam Army (ARVN) which man for man eventually completely dominated (18th ARVN Division and Rangers for example) the Viet Cong and PAVN in the field. The key issues can directly be traced back to a corrupted Government/Officer Corps at a division level and above (the biggest issues) combined with the elimination of aid by Ford Administration. People forget the ARVN was the 5th largest and most experienced Army in the world when it came to Counter Insurgency (COIN) operations.


The politics of South Vietnam are an interesting case study because the constant fear by the various governments of coups never allowed them to fully concentrate the best of their divisions in the field against the Viet Cong/PAVN. We struggled to "Win their Hearts and Mind" but whatever progress we made would quickly become undone by the South Vietnamese government in some act against the civilian populace (see the oppression of Buddhism as a prime example) and the "Strategic Hamlet" program.

Now you mention technology which begs me to ask you how long did Osama bin Laden maintain his position without compromising it for so long? People... Again we circle back to those who are ideologically committed to the "cause" and no amount of force or pressure can ever dissuade them or replace their beliefs. The threat of "oppression" can make people do what is necessary to survive no regardless of the cost.

Let us not forget the immortal words of Ho Chi Minh "You can kill ten of our men for every one we kill of yours. But even at those odds, you will lose and we will win. "
 
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GulfCharlie said:
I feel the need to chime in here so please forgive me.

You forget that the North Vietnamese were ideologically committed individuals who were ready and willing to implement Vietnamese independence at all costs after years of occupation. The Vietnam war started out as such but eventually morphed into the position of Vietnamisation, hoping that the South Vietnamese would be able to stand up against the National Liberation Front for South Vietnam (Viet Cong) and PAVN incursions form the North and West. The Viet Cong started out a multiparty organisation with the aim of driving out all "oppressors" but with attrition and Hanoi's influence, the multiparty individuals that were left became marginalised thereby ensuring Hanoi's complete control over the Viet Cong.

We have not even covered the Republic of Vietnam Army (ARVN) which man for man eventually completely dominated (18th ARVN Division and Rangers for example) the Viet Cong and PAVN in the field. The key issues can directly be traced back to a corrupted Government/Officer Corps at a division level and above (the biggest issues) combined with the elimination of aid by Ford Administration. People forget the ARVN was the 5th largest and most experienced Army in the world when it came to Counter Insurgency (COIN) operations.


The politics of South Vietnam are an interesting case study because the constant fear by the various governments of coups never allowed them to fully concentrate the best of their divisions in the field against the Viet Cong/PAVN. We struggled to "Win their Hearts and Mind" but whatever progress we made would quickly become undone by the South Vietnamese government in some act against the civilian populace (see the oppression of Buddhism as a prime example) and the "Strategic Hamlet" program.

Now you mention technology which begs me to ask you how long did Osama bin Laden maintain his position without compromising it for so long? People... Again we circle back to those who are ideologically committed to the "cause" and no amount of force or pressure can ever dissuade them or replace their beliefs. The threat of "oppression" can make people do what is necessary to survive no regardless of the cost.

Let us not forget the immortal words of Ho Chi Minh "You can kill ten of our men for every one we kill of yours. But even at those odds, you will lose and we will win. "
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That;s cool bro but I aint' reading that, sorry to hear that/ happy for you!

Just kidding. Yeah that makes sense, but I don't think there are Americans that are that die-hard to protect their sect/radical form of thinking if they chose to rebel, only thing that really comes close are nutso cults that spring up every now and then
 
GulfCharlie said:
I feel the need to chime in here so please forgive me.

You forget that the North Vietnamese were ideologically committed individuals who were ready and willing to implement Vietnamese independence at all costs after years of occupation. The Vietnam war started out as such but eventually morphed into the position of Vietnamisation, hoping that the South Vietnamese would be able to stand up against the National Liberation Front for South Vietnam (Viet Cong) and PAVN incursions form the North and West. The Viet Cong started out a multiparty organisation with the aim of driving out all "oppressors" but with attrition and Hanoi's influence, the multiparty individuals that were left became marginalised thereby ensuring Hanoi's complete control over the Viet Cong.

We have not even covered the Republic of Vietnam Army (ARVN) which man for man eventually completely dominated (18th ARVN Division and Rangers for example) the Viet Cong and PAVN in the field. The key issues can directly be traced back to a corrupted Government/Officer Corps at a division level and above (the biggest issues) combined with the elimination of aid by Ford Administration. People forget the ARVN was the 5th largest and most experienced Army in the world when it came to Counter Insurgency (COIN) operations.


The politics of South Vietnam are an interesting case study because the constant fear by the various governments of coups never allowed them to fully concentrate the best of their divisions in the field against the Viet Cong/PAVN. We struggled to "Win their Hearts and Mind" but whatever progress we made would quickly become undone by the South Vietnamese government in some act against the civilian populace (see the oppression of Buddhism as a prime example) and the "Strategic Hamlet" program.

Now you mention technology which begs me to ask you how long did Osama bin Laden maintain his position without compromising it for so long? People... Again we circle back to those who are ideologically committed to the "cause" and no amount of force or pressure can ever dissuade them or replace their beliefs. The threat of "oppression" can make people do what is necessary to survive no regardless of the cost.

Let us not forget the immortal words of Ho Chi Minh "You can kill ten of our men for every one we kill of yours. But even at those odds, you will lose and we will win. "
Click to expand...
Sir this is a Wendy's
 
CS22 said:
How we gonna mention bin laden like 2 posts above people talking about covered parking.
Click to expand...
Welcome to pointsixtyfive dot com. Amazes me how with how focused our jobs require us to be how ADD we are on this website.
 
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