Certifying trainees and line bidding

[Homsar]

I’ve been to multiple facilities now, and every time a training controller certifies, a new RDO line is opened either in accordance with the local MOU or at the Facrep/ATM’s discretion. The new line is then bid by seniority, with the the now-previous line of the controller who vacates their line to take the newly opened line assigned to the newly certified controller, if that makes sense.

We just had that situation happen at my current facility, and were told from outside the facility (the facrep was at a conference and it was brought it up I guess) that we can’t do that, that the new line added by the certifying of the controller is automatically assigned to the controller who certified, regardless of seniority. This caused a lot of anger here, because it was a Friday-Saturday line, and lots of people above the guy who certified would have taken it had it been bid.

It was NATCA who prevented this RDO bid from happening, too, not the agency.

Is there some new rule that’s being imposed to prevent lines opened by certifying controllers, or are we getting screwed?

 

[Rico]

Unless the Agency has declared an A46 imbalance, I don't see why the trainee wouldn't keep the days off they bid for the year.

 

[GulfBravoPapa]

We always bid the new RDO line as you said. Whatever is available when we get to the new CPC's spot in seniority is what they get.

 

[Rico]

We always bid the new RDO line as you said. Whatever is available when we get to the new CPC's spot in seniority is what they get.

What a waste. Who wants to change days off in the middle of the year?

 

[Homsar]

We always bid the new RDO line as you said. Whatever is available when we get to the new CPC's spot in seniority is what they get

That’s the process I’m familiar with, and I’m surprised that it’s supposedly changed, or incorrect.

What a waste. Who wants to change days off in the middle of the year?

To go from a Monday/Tuesday to a Friday/Saturday? Uh yeah, sign me up.

 

[Mike Kilo]

We always bid the new RDO line as you said. Whatever is available when we get to the new CPC's spot in seniority is what they get.

Same with what I’ve seen.

What a waste. Who wants to change days off in the middle of the year?

If I had a family and that schedule worked better I would. I generally don’t bid a lot of leave so that wouldn’t be an issue. Almost always will find someone to take Fri/Sat for a bit.

 

[DA]

If a cpc line opens it should be bid by seniority but more likely what your rep was told is that the dev doesn’t move just because they certified. If a staffing imbalance doesn’t exist then just leave them there until next time you bid.

 

[Plusorminus]

If a cpc line opens it should be bid by seniority but more likely what your rep was told is that the dev doesn’t move just because they certified. If a staffing imbalance doesn’t exist then just leave them there until next time you bid.

Sounds like bs to me. Every cpc should be given the chance at a better schedule if a trainee now counts towards the numbers. Why should they suffer for 6+ months if it should be available immediately

 

[Electricfence]

Your mou should specify what occurs. And it can be different everywhere or it was left out by accident.

Also, if local Natca is involved in building the bats schedule, you’ll see how managment thinks and know well in advance what the available lines will be. In my opinion it’s always better to create the ideal schedule, be offered to bid from that, and the let cpcs bid. Whatever is left is then offered to the trainees, left open, or not bud at all That way, if a trainee certifies they know what they go to. Or if your facility doesn’t want it that way don’t offer those lines to be bud. but then you deal with the mess where that trainee lines becomes available to everyone since it’s now a Cpc line or in the mou says it’s not offered they just stay where they are

 

[DA]

Sounds like bs to me. Every cpc should be given the chance at a better schedule if a trainee now counts towards the numbers. Why should they suffer for 6+ months if it should be available immediately

Your dev is a bue as well. You’re suggesting shitting on their bid leave and rdo schedule so a couple vultures can pick up some scraps.

 

[Phanatical]

If a cpc line opens it should be bid by seniority but more likely what your rep was told is that the dev doesn’t move just because they certified. If a staffing imbalance doesn’t exist then just leave them there until next time you bid.

Exactly this. There should be no reason someone’s bidded days should have to get moved just because they certified mid-year if it does not pose a staffing imbalance determined by management.

 

[GulfBravoPapa]

Your dev is a bue as well. You’re suggesting shitting on their bid leave and rdo schedule so a couple vultures can pick up some scraps.

Where I have been once a trainee certifies if they are forced to change their RDOs their bid leave changes with them. If a CPC bids a new line mid year their bid leave is not adjusted.

 

[Mr.Tickles]

Sounds like bs to me. Every cpc should be given the chance at a better schedule if a trainee now counts towards the numbers. Why should they suffer for 6+ months if it should be available immediately

They’re not a trainee. They’re a CPC and they’re working the RDOs they bid.

 

[AB19]

When I certified I had to move to days and had to cancel some leave to protect my annual leave, they said my leave would be protected but I had to come up with the extra leave from having to protect more RDOs then I had originally bid for

 

[Plusorminus]

They’re not a trainee. They’re a CPC and they’re working the RDOs they bid.

That's what I meant. A trainee turned CPC that counts for the numbers.

Where I have been once a trainee certifies if they are forced to change their RDOs their bid leave changes with them. If a CPC bids a new line mid year their bid leave is not adjusted.

If you have to shift a couple of days to make the leave work, why wouldn't you.. Isn't that what sick leave is for? People don't actually use SL when they're sick. I mean each to their own but if you can bid a better schedule, leave isn't the biggest issue. I'm just saying I'd like to be offered the opportunity and not have someone way down in seniority work a Fri/Sat schedule for another 7 months if that could be me.

 

[Dousand24]

New CPCs should move if there’s an imbalance.

 

[Plusorminus]

Your dev is a bue as well. You’re suggesting shitting on their bid leave and rdo schedule so a couple vultures can pick up some scraps.

Lol @ vultures. Seniority means everything to this career. Sucks if you're stuck down low for a while. No ones saying they have to lose their bid leave. Leave you bid is still your leave. God forbid mgmt won't be flexible knowing that you had to shift your rdo because you HAD to.

 

[DA]

That's what I meant. A trainee turned CPC that counts for the numbers.


If you have to shift a couple of days to make the leave work, why wouldn't you.. Isn't that what sick leave is for? People don't actually use SL when they're sick. I mean each to their own but if you can bid a better schedule, leave isn't the biggest issue. I'm just saying I'd like to be offered the opportunity and not have someone way down in seniority work a Fri/Sat schedule for another 7 months if that could be me.

You’re denying a colleague their bid line for your own personal benefit. I think we fundamentally disagree on how this should be handled because you’re only looking at how you can win and I’m advocating for the whole bargaining unit.

Lol @ vultures. Seniority means everything to this career. Sucks if you're stuck down low for a while. No ones saying they have to lose their bid leave. Leave you bid is still your leave. God forbid mgmt won't be flexible knowing that you had to shift your rdo because you HAD to.

Seniority is everything. Go prove a staffing imbalance. It’s not hard at a small facility. If you can get there then you justify opening the correct line and run it down the line from the top. If there’s no staffing imbalance then let the new guy sit on those training days they certified on. It’s the last time they’ll have good RDOs for a few years most likely.

 

[Plusorminus]

You’re denying a colleague their bid line for your own personal benefit. I think we fundamentally disagree on how this should be handled because you’re only looking at how you can win and I’m advocating for the whole bargaining unit.

Who said I'm going to win.. I'm saying if it were me I'd like to be offered the opportunity. (Speaking for everyone above me) so that means I'm advocating for the whole bargaining unit too? We should both run for FacReps.

 

[ManBearPig]

Like others have said, the trainee stays on their bid days unless that creates an imbalance. To relieve the imbalance, a line is created on other days, and that is bid on by seniority. If no one bids it, the trainee is forced there.