LOUD NOISES

[SIXTY-NINE]

You literally asked in the chat box how you go from AG to D1 to D2 but you're going to fix the system that is broken. Interesting.

Like I said, "One generation plants the seeds; another gets the shade."

 

[Shikaka]

We got a few squeaky wheels that spend their time in the base bulding waiting for letters about things...

 

[Easybreezybeautiful]

I wasn’t around in the before-times, but is it possible that the entitlement in the hiring threads has to do with lack of context? A lot of people apparently don’t know how to read the FAQ’s, or even a single page back in the forum they’re in, so it’s entirely possible that they literally just don’t realize the scale of the operation they’re in.
Not an apologist, I just don’t think that suddenly the public became bigger babies.

 

[Mike Kilo]

I wasn’t around in the before-times, but is it possible that the entitlement in the hiring threads has to do with lack of context? A lot of people apparently don’t know how to read the FAQ’s, or even a single page back in the forum they’re in, so it’s entirely possible that they literally just don’t realize the scale of the operation they’re in.
Not an apologist, I just don’t think that suddenly the public became bigger babies.

I’m pretty sure they did.

 

[Shikaka]

I'm pretty sure they don't understand out of 30,000 applicants there is probably going to be a few hundred controllers.

 

[Easybreezybeautiful]

I’m pretty sure they did.

What makes you think that? It’s kind of hard for me to compare... for one I’m a younger guy moving to aviation from an entirely different industry, so I don’t have the history. But also it’s hard to know how these same people would’ve responded to the extended wait and BioQ because that’s not the world they live in.

 

[SIXTY-NINE]

FAA started changing the bio-q before the lawsuit. All the lawsuit did was give some people who aged out that year a chance to apply again, and made the FAA crack down on giving TOL’s to military controllers who were outside the 120 day EAS window.

That doesn't mean that there weren't problems with the Bio-Q.

 

[DankVectorz]

Guess what would have happened if no one filed that lawsuit against the FAA because the Bio-Q was flawed? We'd still be using it today.

FAA started changing the bio-q before the lawsuit. All the lawsuit did was give some people who aged out that year a chance to apply again, and made the FAA crack down on giving TOL’s to military controllers who were outside the 120 day EAS window.

(reposted to quote the proper part, quoted wrong sentence in last post)

That doesn't mean that there weren't problems with the Bio-Q.

Obviously there was which is why they changed it

 

[GulfCharlie]

I'm pretty sure they don't understand out of 30,000 applicants there is probably going to be a few hundred controllers.

You need to see those ROMATSA numbers... I think for Romania alone there was a graph of (don't quote me ) 50k people applying, 10k getting selected for the interviews/testing/etc... 10 people getting selected for the classes and like 5 fully certifying.

 

[SIXTY-NINE]

Obviously there was which is why they changed it

Like I said, if everyone said "Oh there's nothing wrong with the Bio-Q! The system works!" then it wouldn't have changed, Clearly there were some efforts to change the system that ended up being successful- which is why we have the ATSAT, and later on the ATSA.

Do you think those people that aged out and got a chance again are happy the system was improved , or unhappy?

 

[DankVectorz]

Like I said, if everyone said "Oh there's nothing wrong with the Bio-Q! The system works!" then it wouldn't have changed,

no, you said if a lawsuit hadn’t been filed then nothing would have changed. But that’s not accurate because they started working on changes months before the lawsuit. They realized it was messed up when 2,000 out of 28,000 passed it.

and the people who aged out were given a second chance to apply.

 

[SIXTY-NINE]

no, you said if a lawsuit hadn’t been filed then nothing would have changed. But that’s not accurate because they started working on changes months before the lawsuit. They realized it was messed up when 2,000 out of 28,000 passed it.

Then I made a mistake saying that the lawsuit forced the change. I admit to that error.

Overall the system was improved by the Bio-Q being replaced- and that's great! Obviously someone had to say "Wow, 2000 out of 28000 passed, there must be something we can change/improve for testing", the impetus didn't appear from nowhere.

 

[corn4ahead]

They realized it was messed up when 2,000 out of 28,000 passed it.

I was one of the 2,000. I consider myself a genius...and definitely NOT a mistake.

 

[Roger_Roger]

My favorite part of the BQ was failing it the first time and then passing the same exact test the second time with the same answers.

 

[GulfCharlie]

My favorite part of the BQ was failing it the first time and then passing the same exact test the second time with the same answers.

My favourite part was applying (not just myself but others that had military/contract experience for YEARS) with a CTO + experience and told myself and others did not qualify... or how did they word it? Thankfully they did the experience bid in the January of '15 rather quickly... 35 facilities to choose from and anything in CA went straight to the bottom.

 

[Kilo popa]

Developmentals

I was one of the 2,000. I consider myself a genius...and definitely NOT a mistake.

same . Not bad. Sitting at beaver for 10 days and get picked up on the first bid. I took the bio q with 4 min before I had to run out the door to go fly.

 

[Mike Kilo]

My favorite part of the BQ was failing it the first time and then passing the same exact test the second time with the same answers.

I was a CPC 4 or 5 years when the Bio-Q came out. Took it with my brother just to see what it was and failed twice. Such a joke. What were my high school science grades???? Lol.

 

[Mr. Mack]

Just a theory on why new OTS applicants seem to be getting increasingly entitled/whiny about the hiring process, it could simply have to do with where the pool of applicants is sourcing from. Just a few years ago, finding out about this career was almost exclusively via word of mouth. People had a friend/family member etc. already in the agency who would tell them about it. In talking with the people they knew who were already doing the job, those new applicants at least had a ballpark idea of what ATC was, how going through the Federal hiring process worked, etc.

What I saw at the Academy last year though is that a huge portion (if not the majority) of applicants nowadays find out about the job randomly online. They stumble on a Reddit post, or some ad on Facebook or something. All they see is “no college degree needed” and “six-figure salary” and they immediately throw an application together, oftentimes with little to no clue what they’re really even applying for. Then they get super annoyed/bitchy if an HR rep doesn’t reply to their email in 5 minutes, or if they have to travel more than 30 mins for a pre employment test or something. They just don’t understand this isn’t the same as applying for a greeter job at Walmart.

I get that but I was referring to prior experience people, not OTS.....

 

[ClearanceClarence]

I get that but I was referring to prior experience people, not OTS.....

Roger. It doesn’t seem like the prior experience/military people coming in are quite as bad with the whining though.

 

[SIXTY-NINE]

Roger. It doesn’t seem like the prior experience/military people coming in are quite as bad with the whining though.

If being in the military doesn't prepare you for meaningless chores/work then nothing else in your life will...