Andrew
Member
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- 130
69 offers, this is hysterical to me. When will they realize this process is terrible!
corn4ahead
Forum Sage
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- 662
Trust me, they know it's not perfect.
breakaway2000
Forum Sage
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Best way to describe it is 361 days a year, 100% of controllers can't ERR, then 4 days of the year over 99% of controllers can't ERR. NATCA can pull the escape clause at any moment and get rid of it, yet they continue to support it.
Mike Kilo
Legendary Member
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- 2,842
I like the new process, as far as meeting quarterly, having a priority list (that needs a lot of help and should not change after we have paperwork in, as people use that to decide where to apply) etc. What I don't like is the staffing requirements and how they get their numbers. I believe it has a lot of potential.
Sweet Action
Member
- Messages
- 19
Cat 1 or 2 exempt=purgatory
For anyone constantly hitting F5 on the KSN site, last time around they posted selections around 11am est. on Friday
breakaway2000
Forum Sage
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- 1,693
You like the fact that you can only be looked at once a quarter instead of continuously? And that all your ERRs cancel each other out?
breakaway2000
Forum Sage
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Can someone post the list here or PM me the list when it's up, thanks!
Are you referring to having your other TOLs cancelled once you accept one? I think that is one of the better things to come out of this MOU as it was one of the biggest problems with the old system. People were accepting multiple offers, and multiple facilities would be holding a spot for one particular person only to find out they ended up going somewhere else. If you are referring to something else then disregard.
breakaway2000
Forum Sage
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Referring to previously let's say you had 5 ERRs out, each facility would pick up at different times so essentially each one of your ERRs had the potential to be looked at throughout the year and you had more opportunity for advancement. There's no doubt multiple ERRs acceptances was a big issue but that was a really, really easy fix.
Mike Kilo
Legendary Member
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- 2,842
I have no issues with quarterly. And it wasn't continuously before, facilities had to request permission to pull an ERR list and was still subject to staffing considerations as to how many they could select. As far as your ERRs cancelling each other yes. Don't put in paperwork if you won't go there. Pretty simple. As I said I think the priority list shouldn't change after the ERR deadline, because I use the priority numbers to decide where to apply. If my #1 choice is going to select after my other five considerations, I will not put in paperwork to those places, to ensure my chance at my #1.
This is the fault of every person who took advantage of the old system. Accepting ERRs and getting release dates. Then waiting for another facility to make an offer. Accept hat one, still tie up the date screwing over your own coworkers trying to get out, screw over the first facility as they won't get anyone, etc. it sucks that for a declined offer now that they don't move down the list to the next person. I can't believe people still turn down offers in this new system.
I think they could do a much better job all around and I do not like the release policy either, but as far as NCEPT, I do think it has promise.
Mike Kilo
Legendary Member
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- 2,842
Each of your ERRs now are looked at as long as you can be released. So you still have the opportunity to go to any of those five if they are allowed selections. No change there. You just do not get to receive five offers now and get to be choosy. I will admit that would be preferable, but it also ties up the selection proces for a longer period.
Theoretically because of this people will no longer throw out fifty ERRs (though some people are special). This should reduce your competition and increase your chances I would think.
breakaway2000
Forum Sage
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Was referring to continuous as each facility could pull a list at any time (with approval), any time you showed up to work could be the day you get a call. I phrased it poorly with the word 'continuous'.
Here's my main issue. Lets say they even imposed the staffing restrictions of the NCEPT and the acceptance of only one ERR (which I believe everyone supports) with the old system. EX. Controller A has 10 ERR's in. Controller B has 1 ERR in. If each facility (with approval) could pull ERR's when they needed them, Controller A would have a greater statistical chance of at least being looked at. If not selected, fine, at least they had an opportunity to be looked at. Now given the arbitrary nature of the facility priority list which isn't remotely close to an actually representation of which facilities truly need people, if Controller B's one facility jumps near the top, odds are that facility needs more people then eligible ERR's and Controller A is never looked at. Full disclosure, I could probably win an award for worst NCEPT story, I'll PM you.
I do like the back and forth, in your perfect world, the NCEPT quarterly selection process stays the same, Facility Priority List doesn't change after ERR deadlines, and all Cat 1/Cat 2 requirements are removed?
Mike Kilo
Legendary Member
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- 2,842
I understand where you are coming from. And if you could only release one person that may have cost you the job. But at the same time in the old system whoever accepted a job first and get a release got lucky, and your ATM could coordinate for a two year release date for the other controller, which most selecting facilities wouldn't consider as they usually needed people asap. This is essentially the same thing but not written out like it is now.
I think we need to have categories for staffing but that they need reworked as far as numbers etc. If they pull from Cat 2, they should immediately replace that person from a Cat 1 at another facility or something like that. My facility has constantly been releasing people and no new inbounds to bring us back to Cat 1. Doesn't make sense to me.
One nice thing is, it doesn't look like they are discriminating against Cat 2s which I expected.
But yah, I'm okay with quarterly and fixing the priority list changes. That would save controller A in your example by allowing him to also put in for that facility, knowing he has competition to get a release date.
I think we need to have categories for staffing but that they need reworked as far as numbers etc. If they pull from Cat 2, they should immediately replace that person from a Cat 1 at another facility or something like that. My facility has constantly been releasing people and no new inbounds to bring us back to Cat 1. Doesn't make sense to me.
One nice thing is, it doesn't look like they are discriminating against Cat 2s which I expected.
But yah, I'm okay with quarterly and fixing the priority list changes. That would save controller A in your example by allowing him to also put in for that facility, knowing he has competition to get a release date.
- Messages
- 52
- Facility
- STT St. Thomas Tower
If any one can get the list and pm me or put it up I would appreciate it! I'm off today so I won't be able to check it out!
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- 996
Uscolt45, are you a FACREP by chance?