New time off between shifts mandate. Big change

[HurryUpandWait]

Like the fatigue mitigation workgroup that will change controllers working conditions? The FAA does whatever the fuck they want.

They are trying too but nothing will change until NATCA is involved. Are you all really this uneducated?

 

[32andBelow]

They are trying too but nothing will change until NATCA is involved. Are you all really this uneducated?

No people just see the results we’ve gotten from this collaboration approach

 

[Atc12345]

Wouldn’t just straight day / night / mid lines fix all of this? Pretty sure that’s how factory work is. Lowest seniority gets the 3rd shift or what’s left over. Not advocating one way or another but is there anything saying we have to have an alternating schedule throughout the week?

 

[32andBelow]

Wouldn’t just straight day / night / mid lines fix all of this? Pretty sure that’s how factory work is. Lowest seniority gets the 3rd shift or what’s left over. Not advocating one way or another but is there anything saying we have to have an alternating schedule throughout the week?

Having a controller work straight mids for years doesn’t make very good controllers

 

[HammerHead]

Wouldn’t just straight day / night / mid lines fix all of this? Pretty sure that’s how factory work is. Lowest seniority gets the 3rd shift or what’s left over. Not advocating one way or another but is there anything saying we have to have an alternating schedule throughout the week?

They have to be rotating. I wouldn't mind doing my turn working a week of mids once a month. If they forced me to work straight mids only I would be looking for the quickest way out of here. Seniority shouldn't fuck people at the bottom that hard.

 

[Flashy Vectors]

They are trying too but nothing will change until NATCA is involved. Are you all really this uneducated?

Spoken like someone that grew up with participation trophy’s. Just cause NATCA has a seat at the table doesn’t mean we have any power without a better cba that the union is scared to negotiate.

 

[ManBearPig]

Having a controller work straight mids for years doesn’t make very good controllers

100% agree. You could do straight shifts thar rotate every week or 2.

 

[Raise when?]

Where's my fuckin raise?

All these reverse rattlers and straight lines rotating mids can eat a dick. We are not going for these changes, they can’t be dictated without negotiations. If they want them that bad they can also renegotiate the slate book to get them.

Quick, now's our chance. Let's re-up it until 2045! You never know when a republican might be in office!

 

[Dousand24]

Bring back the Covid 5/10 schedule

 

[Atc12345]

They have to be rotating. I wouldn't mind doing my turn working a week of mids once a month. If they forced me to work straight mids only I would be looking for the quickest way out of here. Seniority shouldn't fuck people at the bottom that hard.

Where does it say they have to be rotating? Not saying it makes proficient controllers or it’s desirable. I’d like to know where it would stop them from doing that.

 

[ManBearPig]

Where does it say they have to be rotating? Not saying it makes proficient controllers or it’s desirable. I’d like to know where it would stop them from doing that.

I think he ment "have to be" as he will shank someone if they try to force him to straight mids for a year.

 

[Atc12345]

I think he ment "have to be" as he will shank someone if they try to force him to straight mids for a year.

Haha understandable

 

[CoffeeIV]

they could redefine the "standard" controllers work week"

PATCO proposed a 32 hour work week over 40 years ago. This is likely the best time to get it unless we see the entire federal government go to 32 hour work week down the line.

 

[Logical_Mongoose]

A competent union could see at least a couple moves ahead in a situation like this. But apparently not for NATCA. There are several different paths that the FAA's decision could put NATCA down, but 3 of the more clear-cut paths in my mind are:

A.) If NATCA vocally and vehemently fights against this they'll look terrible politically and to the public. The FAA staked out their position that this decision was based on ensuring the safety of the NAS and the overall health of controllers. Countering with "they didn't ask us first" makes NATCA look weak and petulant. Countering with "our controllers don't want that" doesn't work either. Neither does "it'll cost the agency and the American taxpayers more money." The only somewhat effective counter would be "we'd love for this to happen, but many controllers already work 6 days a week and this scheduling could force them into being at work 7 days a week and we can't sign off on that." So showing strong opposition to this likely doesn't play out well for NATCA with the public or with trying to make a "collaborative" deal/compromise with the FAA.

B.) NATCA caves with whimpers. Email blasts about how they're exploring their options. They'll pull a Lebowski "this will not stand, you know? This aggression will not stand, man." It will get implemented and you'll be told to suck it up. NATCA higher ups will tell you how much they fought for you behind closed doors. Po-tweet, so it goes, embrace the suck you widget of a human.

C.) NATCA leverages with malicious compliance. Release a statement about how they aim to help the FAA be in compliance within that 90 day window and they hope the FAA will be even more committed to the staffing crisis in the near future. The DAY after implementation, offer pats on the back and take every talking head interview they can get their hands on spouting how great it is that the FAA is taking controller fatigue seriously to ensure the safety of the flying public and reiterate the hopes that they'll tackle the staffing crisis with as much decisiveness. The day after that NATCA begins an unspoken "Operation Air Safety 2.0" and rolling "blue flu" across the country. Avoid most mainstream media after and offer "thoughts and prayers" tweets/press releases. Just in time for election season too. Chaos should bring the FAA to the table almost immediately. If they refuse to "mutually" reopen the Slate Book by August then secure wave after wave of pay-based MOUs with an 18 year (/s) CBA extension. Yearly retention bonus MOU, staggered OT pay scale MOU, yearly length of service raise MOU, all tied to the expiration of the extended CBAs (let Purple and Light Blue bask in the glory as well). Pleasure doing business with you.

Less back slappin', more kneecappin'.

 

[Billybob]

Here's my 2 cents hours into this revelation:

1. Not one single one of us knows whats going on or how the union/agency will respond. At this point nobody knows anything, and any planning or outlook is speculative bullshit at best.
2. ALL and I mean ALL of us are waiting to see what happens because we know somebody is going to get fucked on this deal we just can't quite figure out who it's going to be yet.

 

[Rx]

Here's my 2 cents hours into this revelation:

1. Not one single one of us knows whats going on or how the union/agency will respond. At this point nobody knows anything, and any planning or outlook is speculative bullshit at best.
2. ALL and I mean ALL of us are waiting to see what happens because we know somebody is going to get fucked on this deal we just can't quite figure out who it's going to be yet.

My 3 cents on this is:

1. Everything is happening
2. It’s all happening at once
3. You got change for a dollar?

 

[KP-ATC]

Having a controller work straight mids for years doesn’t make very good controllers

I guess you haven't been paying attention. The FAA and NATCA both don't give a F about having good controllers.

 

[CinderBlock]

Starting with a mid can’t happen. I mean it can but it would be the single most way to make everything horrible

And for that exact reason is why that’s what management will probably propose

 

[5600k2]

Where does it say they have to be rotating? Not saying it makes proficient controllers or it’s desirable. I’d like to know where it would stop them from doing that.

I’m not 100% certain but I believe it is negotiated on the local level, there are people on here elsewhere that have said they have straight days/eves etc. I know some facilities rotate week by week with less quick turns.

 

[CinderBlock]

Yeah this can fuck right off. Find a way to make something work for the whole membership.

It’s always mid to high seniority that proposes doing shit like this to fuck over everyone below them.